Many thanks to everyone who took the time to take a look at my long-winded post and share your thoughts on the hand, especially from all you CardsChat veterans. I ended up folding, feeling that I had no real way of knowing if he was on a strong draw (in this case any two face cards) or already had me beat with a higher pair. Of course I can't call because any face card, ace or even a 9 if I include pocket 9s in his range, on the turn or river (that's potentially 20 cards or almost half the deck) and I'll be frozen stiff. And of course after reading your comments I realize now that I could have avoided this situation entirely by either folding or 4 betting on the flop, committing myself to a shove. As played, really the only sensible option left was folding.
It seems that everyone shared the same opinion, but I think FP put in a very clear, easy to understand way when he said that:
Originally Posted by F Paulsson
Adopting the principle of never flatting a 3-bet out of position preflop is very unlikely to lose you money in almost any situation.
I will be incorporating this principle into my game immediately. It's one of those deceptively simple, easy to follow principles that immediately makes sense to me because of the complexities inherent in it. Whenever I have decided to flat call a 3-bet out of position, I've always felt, for lack of a better word, awkward, once the flop comes; I've never quite known what to do (unless I hit a monster), and I never really understood why (shows how smart I
am). But I think finally get it.
And please, feel free to set me straight if I'm off base; the only wisdom I claim to have is that as long as you're too proud to admit when you're wrong, you won't learn; and if you don't learn, you don't improve; and if you don't improve all that's left is frustration. (I love it how so much in poker relates to life in general, but I digress...) As you can see I am very eager to improve and learn more from all the smart people here at CardsChat; so no risk in sounding condescending with me, even when it is your intention .
Back to the topic at hand, I feel that flat calling a 3 bet out of position is a lot like open limping and then calling a regular raise out of position. You leave yourself dangling in the wind on the flop, with no real certainty as to the relative strength of your hand, no initiative and no position; you're basically praying for cards, which I've come to suspect is something you want to minimize as much as you possibly can in poker.
Thanks again for reading the post and sharing your thoughts. I promise to get better at being more concise in the future. What can I say, I like to write. Best of luck to you out there,