$4 NLHE Full Ring: $ NLHE Full Ring: 2nd Pair Low Board

$4 NL HE Full Ring: $ NL HE Full Ring: 2nd Pair Low Board

Stage #1502782386: Holdem No Limit $0.02 - 2009-06-27 20:29:44 (ET)
Table: AMES AVE (real money) Seat #1 is the dealer
Seat 1 - LADYJ333 ($3.46 in chips)
Seat 2 - JAYBOURKE ($2.70 in chips)
Seat 3 - FSIL ($0.63 in chips)
Seat 4 - YTSEJAM ($5.29 in chips)
Seat 5 - BLIEVE ($0.32 in chips)
Seat 6 - MAREQ ($4.11 in chips)
Seat 8 - MINSONBABA ($3.97 in chips)
Seat 9 - SUE_G ($4.33 in chips)
JAYBOURKE - Posts small blind $0.01
FSIL - Posts big blind $0.02
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to BLIEVE [8d 8h]
YTSEJAM - Calls $0.02
BLIEVE - Calls $0.02
MAREQ - Raises $0.11 to $0.11
MINSONBABA - Folds
SUE_G - Folds
LADYJ333 - Folds
JAYBOURKE - Calls $0.10
FSIL - Folds
YTSEJAM - Calls $0.09
BLIEVE - Calls $0.09
*** FLOP *** [7d 10h 2h]
JAYBOURKE - Checks
YTSEJAM - Checks
BLIEVE - Checks
MAREQ - Checks
*** TURN *** [7d 10h 2h] <font color='red'>7♥</font>
JAYBOURKE - Checks
YTSEJAM - Bets $0.20
BLIEVE - ???

At this point I have $0.21 left and there was about $0.60 in the pot. But going back to the beginning I called with pocket pair as the villain and limpers ahead of me had stacks much larger than mine. My intention was fold if I dont hit set.

BTW I have no reads with 4 tables going. What to do? What to do?

Hm dont know if I used the converter tool correctly but I was UTG+1 in case that was unclear.

wow 2 views? both by me? wow

BLieve said:

But going back to the beginning I called with pocket pair as the villain and limpers ahead of me had stacks much larger than mine. My intention was fold if I dont hit set.

Click to expand...

This is were you went wrong.
It is the shorter stack that is relevant here, it doesn't matter what their stacks are.
You are short stacked so calling in the hope to hit a set is a very bad idea as your not going to win enough when you do hit to make up for all the times you miss.
To set mine you need a full stack.

As played I'd have shoved preflop after getting raised.
Although really you should have been the one raising yourself and be happy to get it in on boards with not too many overcards.

Deco said:

This is were you went wrong.
It is the shorter stack that is relevant here, it doesn't matter what their stacks are.
You are short stacked so calling in the hope to hit a set is a very bad idea as your not going to win enough when you do hit to make up for all the times you miss.
To set mine you need a full stack.

As played I'd have shoved preflop after getting raised.
Although really you should have been the one raising yourself and be happy to get it in on boards with not too many overcards.

Click to expand...

Yes I realize that mistake now but correct me if I am wrong, it would be about even value to call a raise in this instance if my stack was at least 9 times the raise. I say 9 times because there is a 1 in 9 chance of hitting a set on the flop but since a set doesnt win and/or villain will not go all in 100% of the time when I do hit, maybe 15 times is a better figure. The other theory from what I understand is that your opponents should have at least twice your stack so they would be more willing to call your all ins at these micro levels.

But regardless I would still like to know what the right action is here. One mistake made, not trying to make another.

BLieve said:

Yes I realize that mistake now but correct me if I am wrong, it would be about even value to call a raise in this instance if my stack was at least 9 times the raise. I say 9 times because there is a 1 in 9 chance of hitting a set on the flop but since a set doesnt win and/or villain will not go all in 100% of the time when I do hit, maybe 15 times is a better figure. The other theory from what I understand is that your opponents should have at least twice your stack so they would be more willing to call your all ins at these micro levels.

But regardless I would still like to know what the right action is here. One mistake made, not trying to make another.

Click to expand...

No their stack is completely irrelevant.
Also the 15 times figure would be fine for calling raises, it isn't for limping because:

*The cards they hold are gunna be trashy and aren't going to get all their money in unless they hit something huge.
56s aint gunna get it in when they hit a pair
AK JJ+ are going to get their stack in much more often

*You are going to get raised out of the pot most the time

*Your missing out on the fold equity from your raise and subsequent c-bet if you had raised yourself


To sum up set mining is good when you have a 15times the size of their raise and call or raise yourself.