3 Barrel Bluff Snapped Off by Top Pair

so i'm in the small blind with AK offsuit and a it folds around to the button who makes it 15, I three bet to 40$

This is a live game 100$ buy in my stack is roughly 300$

flop comes Q-7-5 with 2 clubs and I bet 50$ turn is an 8 not a club and I bet 75$. River is another 8 and I jam all in with about 150 behind. my opponent thinks for about 10 seconds each street and calls. Calls the river with QJ offsuit.

Did I fail here or do something wrong?

Well there are a ton of dynamics and metagame and everything else that could effect his decision to call you down but at the end of the day you ran into a calling station and next time when you have the overpair you'll get him.
I probably make it 50$ pre when oop.

Also on the flop whether I bet or not is totally player dependent and if I do fire about 65% pot and get called on that board I'm mostly done with the hand and will check the turn. If he's medium strength like JJ TT he's likely going to check it back and you'll see the river anyway.

Don´t play if U got nothing

to BIGD23: Well, U played with nothing. U had bad luck cause Ur opponent had nice cards as well. so he did call for flop and hit Q.
U had nothin´!!! So then stop playing. If someone calls and calls he´s got something in his hands. To bluff out someone who´s got something is hard. People play everything.
But U played NOTHING !!
Don´t do this and read about the section BLUFF in poker school.
And don´t complain Ur opponent went all in with QQ. U did it with high card A. With nothing!!! so don´t complain if yuo´re thrown out.
play a little tighter
peeetiee

I'm good with the PF raise and the Flop Cbet, but not a big fan of the double barrel, I'm one and done on this flop. The reason for this is that based on the action villain is very unlikely to be peeling with a 7 or a 5 which means you're likely trying to barrel him off FD or a queen, probably a good one. I know QJo might be a little light but once he calls the flop it's optimistic to think he'll fold the turn. In position I might consider betting the river if the clubs brick out. Out of position I check the turn and hope for an Ace or King on the river. Aggression is fine but you shouldn't feel like you have to win every hand you raise.

BigD23 said:

so i'm in the small blind with AK offsuit and a it folds around to the button who makes it 15, I three bet to 40$

This is a live game 100$ buy in my stack is roughly 300$

flop comes Q-7-5 with 2 clubs and I bet 50$ turn is an 8 not a club and I bet 75$. River is another 8 and I jam all in with about 150 behind. my opponent thinks for about 10 seconds each street and calls. Calls the river with QJ offsuit.

Did I fail here or do something wrong?

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You played OOP with nothing. I agree you should have checked after the flop bet got called. Your shove on the end says you have nothing. It happens and I would have lost my chips too.

If bb was $5, your 3 bet was too small. But he called. probably a fish and you tried to move him off top pr. That's a fail.

I think every street was incorrect, even the flop which should have been a check against any decent opponent who just called your 3-bet. You're not folding any hands out on that flop that you're not already beating by betting. Pre-flop was too small, and then you need to have a plan for your hand once you see that flop. I don't hear anything about a plan, just random betting.

If your opponent calls you on that flop IP, you need to have a plan. You really don't have the correct sizing to triple, so you should have bet the turn bigger and then been done w/ the hand. As played, the river is just spew. You're giving him great odds to snap you off with the exact range he has.

If this was 2/5, I'd recommend taking a step back and figure out your sizing and hand planning a little better. This hand was just spew as played.

BigD23 said:

so i'm in the small blind with AK offsuit and a it folds around to the button who makes it 15, I three bet to 40$

This is a live game 100$ buy in my stack is roughly 300$

flop comes Q-7-5 with 2 clubs and I bet 50$ turn is an 8 not a club and I bet 75$. River is another 8 and I jam all in with about 150 behind. my opponent thinks for about 10 seconds each street and calls. Calls the river with QJ offsuit.

Did I fail here or do something wrong?

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I'm ok with flop bet you made maybe even the turn, but not the river you had little to no showdown value any pair beats you the only thing you could beat was a lesser bluff,villian hit top pair on flop and just let you hang yourself on the river,ive lost a lot of money thru the years by not slowing down when playing a-k or just out right not willing to fold the hand when I should of,hand review and hindsight are great for insight on what to do next time wnen playing same hand

peeetiee said:

to BIGD23: Well, U played with nothing. U had bad luck cause Ur opponent had nice cards as well. so he did call for flop and hit Q.
U had nothin´!!! So then stop playing. If someone calls and calls he´s got something in his hands. To bluff out someone who´s got something is hard. People play everything.
But U played NOTHING !!
Don´t do this and read about the section BLUFF in poker school.
And don´t complain Ur opponent went all in with QQ. U did it with high card A. With nothing!!! so don´t complain if yuo´re thrown out.
play a little tighter
peeetiee

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Wow...

John A said:

I think every street was incorrect, even the flop which should have been a check against any decent opponent who just called your 3-bet. You're not folding any hands out on that flop that you're not already beating by betting. Pre-flop was too small, and then you need to have a plan for your hand once you see that flop. I don't hear anything about a plan, just random betting.

If your opponent calls you on that flop IP, you need to have a plan. You really don't have the correct sizing to triple, so you should have bet the turn bigger and then been done w/ the hand. As played, the river is just spew. You're giving him great odds to snap you off with the exact range he has.

If this was 2/5, I'd recommend taking a step back and figure out your sizing and hand planning a little better. This hand was just spew as played.

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this is 2-3 and I would have played pocket aces or kings the same way I played this so not sure what the problem is.

John A said:

I think every street was incorrect, even the flop which should have been a check against any decent opponent who just called your 3-bet. You're not folding any hands out on that flop that you're not already beating by betting.

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Except any pair

John A said:

Pre-flop was too small,

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Too small for what? What are you trying to achieve? With an unmade or weak made hand betting bigger is better because villain is likely to fold a lot of better hands. But AK is a solid hand and fairs well against any PF raising range, especially a button steal. If you raise too much you get him to fold out all the hands you beat and call with all others, you force him to play perfectly.

John A said:

and then you need to have a plan for your hand once you see that flop. I don't hear anything about a plan, just random betting.

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Well, yeah, that's the plan, raise and then bet. If you just did that and nothing else you'd be a winning player without ever even looking at your cards. The problem isn't that he didn't have a plan, it's that the plan didn't change when the conditions did. Bet the flop and then check it down and hope for an Ace or King. It's that simple.

John A said:

If your opponent calls you on that flop IP, you need to have a plan. You really don't have the correct sizing to triple, so you should have bet the turn bigger and then been done w/ the hand. As played, the river is just spew. You're giving him great odds to snap you off with the exact range he has.
If this was 2/5, I'd recommend taking a step back and figure out your sizing and hand planning a little better. This hand was just spew as played.

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Actually I think both the turn and the river were a bit spewy but dropping down a limit isn't the problem. It's not like your playing in Bobby's Room, it's $2/$5 which isn't really any tougher than $1/$2 and the rake is a lot more affordable, at least where I play a Foxwoods. Also, this is just one hand. Everyone is capable of playing a hand badly every now and then, or for that matter, giving bad advice.

Four Dogs said:

Except any pair

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? Let's poll the CC community and ask everyone what pairs they think are folding that are calling that 3-bet. I see zero right now, so which ones are you referring to?

Too small for what? What are you trying to achieve? With an unmade or weak made hand betting bigger is better because villain is likely to fold a lot of better hands. But AK is a solid hand and fairs well against any PF raising range, especially a button steal. If you raise too much you get him to fold out all the hands you beat and call with all others, you force him to play perfectly.

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Right, except it's for value, and if you raise correctly, and are planning to barrel it off w/ AK, you're much better 3-betting larger, betting the flop better and then shoving the turn. There's no plan in this hand.

Well, yeah, that's the plan, raise and then bet. If you just did that and nothing else you'd be a winning player without ever even looking at your cards. The problem isn't that he didn't have a plan, it's that the plan didn't change when the conditions did. Bet the flop and then check it down and hope for an Ace or King. It's that simple.

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Sounds like you're in some good games then. Good for you. I don't play these stakes, so perhaps you're correct. But I think it's a better overall approach when you're playing to actually have a plan for your hand, and if you're asking for advice, to explain what the plan is so people can help you analyze your thought process. Or you can just raise and bet/bet/bet and then go.... oh, what happened? I guess both approaches can work.

Actually I think both the turn and the river were a bit spewy but dropping down a limit isn't the problem. It's not like your playing in Bobby's Room, it's $2/$5 which isn't really any tougher than $1/$2 and the rake is a lot more affordable, at least where I play a Foxwoods. Also, this is just one hand. Everyone is capable of playing a hand badly every now and then, or for that matter, giving bad advice.

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You don't have to like my advice, but I'd advise when critiquing others advice, don't make it personal. Just make a post w/ counter advice. We're all just here to learn.

Four Dogs said:

Everyone is capable of playing a hand badly every now and then, or for that matter, giving bad advice.

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And everyone is capable of being rude but it doesn't mean we have to be.
I fully back John's advice and comments.

Four Dogs said:

Except any pair

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John A said:

? Let's poll the CC community and ask everyone what pairs they think are folding that are calling that 3-bet. I see zero right now, so which ones are you referring to?

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You think all or most pairs are folding preflop to a resteal from the SB? That's is not my experience. I'm not even sure you should when stacks are that deep. I certainly would be interested to hear other opinions on that.

Four Dogs said:

Well, yeah, that's the plan, raise and then bet. If you just did that and nothing else you'd be a winning player without ever even looking at your cards. The problem isn't that he didn't have a plan, it's that the plan didn't change when the conditions did. Bet the flop and then check it down and hope for an Ace or King. It's that simple.

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John A said:

...I think it's a better overall approach when you're playing to actually have a plan for your hand, and if you're asking for advice, to explain what the plan is so people can help you analyze your thought process. Or you can just raise and bet/bet/bet and then go.... oh, what happened? I guess both approaches can work.

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But it seems like that's exactly what you're advocating here.

John A said:

you're much better 3-betting larger, betting the flop better and then shoving the turn.

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That's a plan alright, but I'm not sure it's a good one. You should never feel obligated to blast away OOP just because you're resteal got called by a lag. You raise AK for value and you realize that value when you flop well anything beyond that is just icing on the cake.

John A said:

You don't have to like my advice, but I'd advise when critiquing others advice, don't make it personal. Just make a post w/ counter advice. We're all just here to learn.

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Sorry. There might have been a little more edge to my post than was warranted. I think it was your insinuation that BigD step down a level from what is already the lowest limit you can play live based on one hand which IMO wasn't horrible but could have been played better. It seemed a little excessive.

I don't like this hand. I think preflop is ok but after that you should just give up. Its really hard to get folds from live games so AK shouldn't 3bet a lot in my opinion. Your turn bet is too small also. I think you can have better bluffs in this hand. Like a flush draw or gut shot. Here you are drawing thin and should just try to get to showdown cheap or cheaply hit your K or A.

Four Dogs said:

You think all or most pairs are folding preflop to a resteal from the SB? That's is not my experience. I'm not even sure you should when stacks are that deep. I certainly would be interested to hear other opinions on that.

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I'm invoking logic, in that if someone incorrectly is calling a 3-bet with ~15% of their stack pre-flop, then they likely aren't folding that flop. I think I'm wasting my breath here, but there's no purpose in c-betting when no better hands are folding in this spot. It's poker 101, and I'm not going to try and explain this from a GTO perspective, but you'd rather have someone betting with their dominated range, than you folding it out.

But it seems like that's exactly what you're advocating here.



That's a plan alright, but I'm not sure it's a good one. You should never feel obligated to blast away OOP just because you're resteal got called by a lag. You raise AK for value and you realize that value when you flop well anything beyond that is just icing on the cake.

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Honestly, I don't even know what you're saying. But my point in that example was to show a line that was better than blindly bet/bet/bet. It's of course not an ideal line, or one I'm advocating as the highest EV line.

Sorry. There might have been a little more edge to my post than was warranted. I think it was your insinuation that BigD step down a level from what is already the lowest limit you can play live based on one hand which IMO wasn't horrible but could have been played better. It seemed a little excessive.

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I thought he was playing 2/5, but regardless it was horribly played. Yes, we all make mistakes, but this hand was beyond mistakes. It's not personal in any way, shape or form. I'll just leave with a quote from him...

"this is 2-3 and I would have played pocket aces or kings the same way I played this so not sure what the problem is."

Preflop 3b is too small.


Once V calls the flop, he pretty much says he has Qx. A live V is not going to fold TP.

Turn and river is spew IMO.



And yes, we could just check flop as well, but TBH I bet once and give up after that (unless A or K peels).


I play poker 5 days a week. I have triple barreled with air one time in the last year, and it didn't work.


I also agree with John A for the most part, except I bet flop. It is a dry flop and possible for us to just win right there. Once called OTF, yeah I'm just done.

Should ignore the clubs tbh... This is a 3bet pot so having the flush draw is a stretch.

This guy calls on the flop when he's got Qx or some PP... he will simply fold if he has a weak pair or whiffed.


These guys at 100NL are bad live... They don't know what traps or anything... All they know is I have top pair and it must be good right!... so I'm going to play because that's why i'm here

I'm quite the aggressive player and even I wouldn't bet the turn... Theres just no purpose to it. And we didn't add any equity.

The only place I think you could have won that hand was with a bigger 3 bet. Once your opponent hit top pair, you needed to hit your hand to win. If the flop bet didn't scare him off after the PF3-bet, you have to give it up when you miss the turn