[25NL FR] QQ Jamming Turn ?

I think you're actually ahead of Villain's range here - AQ+,JJ+? 55% on the turn. Jamming makes sense to me here, pot is bigger than Villain's stack at this point.

Would 4betting pf or c/r on the flop have been options here? On the flop, you're 47% against that same range, pf you're 51% against that range.

slycbnew said:

I think you're actually ahead of Villain's range here - AQ+,JJ+? 55% on the turn. Jamming makes sense to me here, pot is bigger than Villain's stack at this point.

Would 4betting pf or c/r on the flop have been options here? On the flop, you're 47% against that same range, pf you're 51% against that range.

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Villains range is much wider than that with a call/call line PF especially with the rather small 3-bet. Shoving the turn here seems fine, but I'm trying to decide if there's a better flop line to take.

4-bet pre cuz playing out of position sucks?

You should have been AIPF or on the flop. I don't see why you think you're behind here?

c9h13no3 said:

4-bet pre cuz playing out of position sucks?

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Against unknown at 25NL I wouldn't be so keen. You're looking at AA or KK way too often unless player is aggro and 3 bets reasonably wide range.

EvilEmperor said:

Against unknown at 25NL I wouldn't be so keen. You're looking at AA or KK way too often unless player is aggro and 3 bets reasonably wide range.

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Dsvw is right, this guy called preflop twice, he's not the original raiser (I missed that above). Awkward situation now since the flush and straight both hit, pushing the flop or 4betting pf would have been better, but as played, I still think you're ahead of his range and shove. Even if you're behind, you have a few potential outs.

I don't play FR, but is 4-betting QQ really a good idea here? Seems to me it essentially turns the hand in to a bluff unless the other player is downright horrible. I do, however, agree that with the way the flop action plays out a CRAI is probably the best line here on the flop. MP1 seems very fishy and is probably calling with any J, maybe some T's, and pretty much any draw.

dsvw56 said:

I don't play FR, but is 4-betting QQ really a good idea here? Seems to me it essentially turns the hand in to a bluff unless the other player is downright horrible.

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I actually like the 4bet pf alot here, and a pretty substantial one - as c9 points out, we're OOP - also, I'd like to pressure the other 2 players right now - if I'm going to see the flop I'd rather be heads-up, and QQ are good enough for me to call a shove with.

Unless I can narrow Villain very specifically to QQ+, AK based on his 3bet, I'm no worse than a coin flip - I don't narrow unknown's ranges that much.

I also find that this does wonders for my table image whether I win or lose this specific hand...

slycbnew said:

I actually like the 4bet pf alot here, and a pretty substantial one - as c9 points out, we're OOP - also, I'd like to pressure the other 2 players right now - if I'm going to see the flop I'd rather be heads-up, and QQ are good enough for me to call a shove with.

Unless I can narrow Villain very specifically to QQ+, AK based on his 3bet, I'm no worse than a coin flip - I don't narrow unknown's ranges that much.

I also find that this does wonders for my table image whether I win or lose this specific hand...

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We aren't worried about his 3-betting range, it's what hands he continues with to a 4-bet. Like I said, I don't play FR, but I'm skeptical to believe that a 25NL FR player's 5-bet shoving range is going to be any wider than JJ+,AK unless he is ridiculously horrible. Sure, calling a shove after 4-betting is going to be +EV at that point, but it's not the most +EV way of playing the hand, imo.

Preflop depends a lot on CO's style. A lot of people 3bet so little at low stakes FR that 4betting has little use.

Once CO is out, i'm always playing for stacks with an overpair 60bb deep. I'd rather do it on flop but shoving turn is fine too.

Dsvw, that makes sense, agree, you and Belgo make great points here - thanks

Ok I jammed turn and he flips AA and I river one of my flush outs for the pot.
Think I need to be generally abit more aggro after reviewing these few hands