$25 NLHE Full Ring: Straight Forward?

skrsh76

skrsh76

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pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (8 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://www.flopturnriver.com

UTG+1 ($25)
MP1 ($35.33)
MP2 ($23.53)
CO ($26.30)
Button ($38.84)
SB ($30.29)
Hero (BB) ($25)
UTG ($25.60)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A
club.gif
, K
spade.gif

1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $0.87, 5 folds, Hero raises to $2.50, UTG+1 calls $1.63

Flop: ($5.10) J
club.gif
, 3
spade.gif
, A
spade.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $2.60, UTG+1 raises to $5.20, Hero calls $2.60

Turn: ($15.50) 8
club.gif
(2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets $7.40, Hero raises to $17.30 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $9.90 (All-In)

River: ($50.10) 3
diamond.gif
(2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $50.10 | Rake: $2
 
PershingSt

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I would fold to the clickback, people at this level just dont do this with bluffs/semi bluffs enough to call imo . I think you are gonna get shown 2 pair or better a lot in this spot
 
TimovieMan

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Just call the turn and c/c a non-spade river. Keep his (semi-)bluffs in.

As played, you're only getting called by his value hands. AJ/JJ/33.
 
c9h13no3

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Just call the turn and c/c a non-spade river. Keep his (semi-)bluffs in.

As played, you're only getting called by his value hands. AJ/JJ/33.
His flush draws have to call 10 to win 40ish, they can't fold. Plus no one is bluffing the river with $10 behind a $30 pot. Good shove.

Looks good, NH.
 
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MinhANguyen

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He should have almost no combos of flush draws, given that the As is on the board and we have the Ks. With the Ks blocker and backdoor draw, just check the flop and see what he does. We can't get three streets from an UTG +1 range in a 3-bet pot full-ring anyway, and we are not doing that well against his continuing range. You're probably beat on the flop by AJs/JJ.
 
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PershingSt

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He should have almost no combos of flush draws, given that the As is on the board and we have the Ks. With the Ks blocker and backdoor draw, just check the flop and see what he does. We can't get three streets from an UTG +1 range in a 3-bet pot full-ring anyway, and we are not doing that well against his continuing range. You're probably beat on the flop by AJs/JJ.

This is spot on
 
skrsh76

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He should have almost no combos of flush draws, given that the As is on the board and we have the Ks. With the Ks blocker and backdoor draw, just check the flop and see what he does. We can't get three streets from an UTG +1 range in a 3-bet pot full-ring anyway, and we are not doing that well against his continuing range. You're probably beat on the flop by AJs/JJ.
Interesting... do you then recommend. Check calling all the way?
 
M

MinhANguyen

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In this spot, I generally check, bet, bet, and fold to any raises whatsoever. It's rare that I've actually ever had to check-call down because most people would try to trap with JJ here, for example. They would check flop, call or raise turn, or raise river if they tried to slowplay the flop & turn. But let's say he does not slowplay JJ here. We check-call two barrels and check-fold river. AK should not be 3-barreling for value against us, and it's super unlikely anyone tries to 3-barrel us when our range is face-up to TPGK/TPTK.

Without the Ks, it is okay to c-bet since he can have combo draws like KQss and KJss sometimes. Checking and c-betting without Ks are both okay.

People are not going to bluff at this board texture much, so don't worry. I used to be wary of checking such boards, thinking my opponents might try to bluff me. But people generally play more honestly in 3-bet pots, and they aren't going to try to rep the A if they don't have it. I remember this one deep-stacked reg on Zone 100NL once typed, "KK huh. I should shove lol." He gave up after a weak turn bet. Everytime I got barreled off in a 3-bet pot when I was the PFR, it was generally very strong.
 
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TimovieMan

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He should have almost no combos of flush draws, given that the As is on the board and we have the Ks.
Well spotted.

With the Ks blocker and backdoor draw, just check the flop and see what he does. We can't get three streets from an UTG +1 range in a 3-bet pot full-ring anyway, and we are not doing that well against his continuing range. You're probably beat on the flop by AJs/JJ.
I agree.
 
c9h13no3

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Wait, you're folding AK in a 5 SPR pot to a raise? Run that one through the sanity checker please.

And I totally disagree that people play honestly in 3-bet pots. Once you 3-bet (especially blind vs blind) all this weird machismo gets involved. Hell, go look at the "calling with ace high" threads that have been posted lately.
 
M

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Stacking off AK in a SPR pot of 5 means you're likely to be behind unless there is a dynamic going on (aggro blind v blind war or blind vs BTN/CO for instance). This is full-ring UTG + 1 v BB, where ranges are much more narrow. We also hold the Ks blocker, so he has almost no semi-bluffs. Like what do you expect to be ahead of when he raises this flop vs your 3-bet range?

I did not say people play honestly in 3-bet pots. I said they generally play more honestly in 3-bet pots, than opposed to say single-raised pots. That wasn't the only reason I gave for why his range is strong, just a minor one. And this isn't blind v blind. It's UTG + 1 vs BB full-ring.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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You keep quoting that villain has few combo draws. But you're right whether we have the blockers or not. QJs, JTs, QTs, KQs, KJs, maybe KTs? But many of those fold to the three bet or don't raise UTG. There just aren't many suited hands in a 3bet pot period (especially when the ace is out).

The key point is this though: If you're not comfortable stacking TPTK in a 3-bet pot, don't 3bet. People turn hands like TT or KQo into bluffs, get excited about AQ. Anything that beats us is hard to make with a high enough frequency to be afraid of, unless your opponent's range is KK+ only.

EDIT - Corrected stupid autocorrect typos from my phone like 8 times.
 
Trabendo_daze

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I can't imagine we are good here since after betting this flop we always have an ace and so a bluff from villain is quite unlikely. Our range is so well-defined as at least AQ, probably better, so I think villain is dissuaded from bluffing here. Furthermore, like Minh said there just aren't too many combos of things that he's semi-bluffing with.

I'm inclined to think we're beat at the turn, if not at the flop raise. Getting this in doesn't feel right.
 
M

MinhANguyen

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Tptk+ does not mean auto-stack off in a 3-bet pot... You're saying hands like AA and AK are auto-stack off on boards like KQJ vs flop raises or turn raises, which is pretty bad. This is quite an extreme example, but there are numerous other boards or scenarios/dynamics in which we don't want to stack off with an SPR of 5+.

We shouldn't be 3-betting if we can't comfortably stack off TPTK? Like what? It doesnt have to do anything with whether or not we are comfortable stacking TPTK. It's just our range vs his stack-off/raising range, and whether or not we can profitably call/get it in.
 
Figaroo2

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Hmm. Do we know anything about the EP player at all? It makes such a big difference if we know his tendencies.
His line is so strong and the lack of draws suggest JJ KK
here so unless he's mega aggro I'm letting this one go on the turn.
His value looking turn sizing is begging you to call and is the evidence I'm looking for after the flop min raise. As played I fold the turn.
Having said all that if he's the loose type that often refuse to fold to 3bets then his range will be much wider and we can happily stack off. It depends......
 
B

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since it's full ring people plays big pots with big hands generally, unlikely to bluff, i think big reraise on turn beat us like JJ/AJ probably your hand way behind you beat AQ mb, anyway this turn bet said me 'this more than just pair' like you hold, so fold turn.
 
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