$200 NLHE : Tricky Spot with Set: What Would You Do?

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RakeMyLife

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Not looking for feedback necessarily, just thought this was a cool hand that everyone could take a stab at.

Live $1/2 game, table is run of the mill for casino games (loose, passive).

Preflop: I am BB with 55 (~$330 behind). UTG+1 raises to $10. 2 callers (MP, cutoff). I call.

Flop: 5-6-10 (rainbow). I check, UTG+1 bets $20. Call, call, I call (risky i know, don't worry).

Turn: 9. I lead out $60. Fold, MP insta-raises to $225 (grabbed a stack of $25s, didn't count), cutoff insta-calls all in. Action to you...?

Some info on villains: MP had ~$400 to start the hand, LAG, but never showed a complete bluff. Cutoff was TAGfish, ~$120 to start.

So... ship it, call, or fold? What do u put MP villain on? Will post spoiler later.
 
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Doey96

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Not looking for feedback necessarily, just thought this was a cool hand that everyone could take a stab at.

Live $1/2 game, table is run of the mill for casino games (loose, passive).

Preflop: I am BB with 55 (~$330 behind). UTG+1 raises to $10. 2 callers (MP, cutoff). I call.

Flop: 5-6-10 (rainbow). I check, UTG+1 bets $20. Call, call, I call (risky i know, don't worry).

Turn: 9. I lead out $60. Fold, MP insta-raises to $225 (grabbed a stack of $25s, didn't count), cutoff insta-calls all in. Action to you...?

Some info on villains: MP had ~$400 to start the hand, LAG, but never showed a complete bluff. Cutoff was TAGfish, ~$120 to start.

So... ship it, call, or fold? What do u put MP villain on? Will post spoiler later.

Hi, I think the best play here would be to if re raised on the flop which would probably get rid of top pair hands and I'd also probably re raise a good amount because there are straight possibilities on the bored and especially because there are 4 going to the flop a hand like 7-6 suited would most likely call pre flop due to implied odds. With the 9 hitting the turn and then the action infront of you being a raise and then a shove on top I think you've not got the best hand anymore. Also hands like 66's and 1010's which is probably unlikely but would still have you beat. So I think the best play would of been to re raise on the flop and get rid of hands like top pair and not giving the right odds for an up and down straight draw to call and take the pot down there because if you get a call then I'd start to think about my opponent having a bigger set.

Rob D 😅
 
Aces2w1n

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This is 1/2 .... due to no AA or KK in MPs range or even AKs.

In my experience if someone is screaming strength at this level it generally is what it is.

Id snap fold but u havnt told us suits or anything. These guys could overplay medium overpairs like jj or qq

Rest crushes us. MW pot... less chance of bluffs

So yeah fold instantly
 
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Doey96

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This is 1/2 .... due to no AA or KK in MPs range or even AKs.

In my experience if someone is screaming strength at this level it generally is what it is.

Id snap fold but u havnt told us suits or anything. These guys could overplay medium overpairs like jj or qq

Rest crushes us. MW pot... less chance of bluffs

So yeah fold instantly

Yeah a fold here would be correct. Sometimes you gotta learn to let em go!
 
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RakeMyLife

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Hi, I think the best play here would be to if re raised on the flop which would probably get rid of top pair hands and I'd also probably re raise a good amount because there are straight possibilities on the bored and especially because there are 4 going to the flop a hand like 7-6 suited would most likely call pre flop due to implied odds. With the 9 hitting the turn and then the action infront of you being a raise and then a shove on top I think you've not got the best hand anymore. Also hands like 66's and 1010's which is probably unlikely but would still have you beat. So I think the best play would of been to re raise on the flop and get rid of hands like top pair and not giving the right odds for an up and down straight draw to call and take the pot down there because if you get a call then I'd start to think about my opponent having a bigger set.

Rob D 😅

Yea, just a note on the flop: I had every intention of check-raising and probably do 80% of the time here, but when action came back to me I felt like I wanted to disguise my hand instead (I felt I knew my opponents well enough also), knowing full well the board could get worse and I may have to reevaluate. Also, the suits were irrelevant in this hand so I know the only hands I fear are straight draws and other sets.
 
Cmoneytaker5

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you should lead the flop...78s is possible or he just overbet the flop to represent a straight holding pocket T's or J's.
I was in tough situation like this with a set of 6's in a multiway pot 1 vilain shoved 1 folded 1 called and it was my time to call or fold on o pot of 1000+ eu ...i folded my set and i was right they poth had made a straight.
 
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When the pot is already over 100 after checking on flop, i would have raised to 150-175 and if they call/raise they have a higher set or two pairor overpair or openender since you said loose passive. If they raise it, its a fold.
After the turn(if they call my raise), I would have to think whether i would want to gamble with my remaining stack or not. If they give any signs of weakness (not feigned), I might push it in or just check and see. If after checking they pop it, I would be leaning towards folding it but it will be a very difficult decision on turn (first decision) for me whether to pop/check since they called my raise on flop.

With the way you played, I would have folded it since a set now looks too weak to gamble with still river to come out.
 
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I would guess there is at least other set held by one of those. And since you have the bottom set, its time to fold'em.
 
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RakeMyLife

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you should lead the flop...78s is possible or he just overbet the flop to represent a straight holding pocket T's or J's.
I was in tough situation like this with a set of 6's in a multiway pot 1 vilain shoved 1 folded 1 called and it was my time to call or fold on o pot of 1000+ eu ...i folded my set and i was right they poth had made a straight.

So this would be my line ~10% of the time. I don't mind checking to the raiser with strong hands (esp bc live players seem to be so much more pot committed when they are leading) and have them figure out what I might have when I call or check-raise. I usually lead out when I know villain is either strong as well or too aggressive (and will 3 bet me).

In this hand, I did not expect two callers behind the original raiser given the board...
 
Omahahahaha

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No way am I just calling the flop here. Okay, the board is a decent one to slowplay on (fairly dry), but you have two players who have already called the flop bet. It's one thing to give a free card to one guy, quite another to give three people a free shot at cracking your hand. And there are now three people who might potentially call your raise. I'm popping it up on the flop to $100.

On the turn we have to stack off. CO could have T9 or even something like JJ that got confused by our flop line. There is enough in the middle that we have to gamble.
 
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RakeMyLife

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Ok so SPOILER ALERT:

For those of who said "fold" u were correct!

MP showed 66 for a set. Cutoff mucked after the river blanked.

At the end of the day, I couldn't figure out what hands I could beat, save maybe 9/10, that villain would bet the way he did, and I folded as well...
 
quick

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Interesting hand and spot. I check-raise the flop here. One, there's two people against me, and I'm betting one is drawing or is committed to an overpair. Two, If other villain than shoves, I don't think I'm getting away from a set here. Maybe, and this is a big maybe, if a face card falls on flop I might consider they raised with a higher pocket pair and hit their JJJ or QQQ or something. But the chances of set over set are so slim that if it happens it happens.

I agree with Omahahaha on this one here. We can't give away cheap or free cards and we would likely be stacking off on turn anyways. So maybe one player shows up with 78 for the turned straight? If we shove turn or call a shove we still have 10 outs to improve. I'm not even considering set over set possibility when I'm stacking off here. :)
 
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RakeMyLife

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Interesting hand and spot. I check-raise the flop here. One, there's two people against me, and I'm betting one is drawing or is committed to an overpair. Two, If other villain than shoves, I don't think I'm getting away from a set here. Maybe, and this is a big maybe, if a face card falls on flop I might consider they raised with a higher pocket pair and hit their JJJ or QQQ or something. But the chances of set over set are so slim that if it happens it happens.

I agree with Omahahaha on this one here. We can't give away cheap or free cards and we would likely be stacking off on turn anyways. So maybe one player shows up with 78 for the turned straight? If we shove turn or call a shove we still have 10 outs to improve. I'm not even considering set over set possibility when I'm stacking off here. :)

I think it's important to take into account all factors (position, table image, opponents, stacks, board) when considering a certain line with sets. As mentioned before, I would check-raise 80% of the time in a hand like this, but felt confident I could read the board and my opponents on later streets. This forum seems terrified of giving away "free cards" (though there wasn't one here)!
 
quick

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I think it's important to take into account all factors (position, table image, opponents, stacks, board) when considering a certain line with sets. As mentioned before, I would check-raise 80% of the time in a hand like this, but felt confident I could read the board and my opponents on later streets. This forum seems terrified of giving away "free cards" (though there wasn't one here)!

You make a valid point about all factors. And you also make a good point about the texture of this board being not too scary in terms of letting free cards pop off on turn. It's not flush draw heavy, it's not really connected (although villain could have 78 or 79 and even then not too scary).

However, in considering opponents range here what might they have? We can assume they don't have AA-QQ as they're likely going to 4 bet you pre flop here anyways (although as you said, there's a lot to consider, I stacked a guy recently who thought it was a good idea to limp in with AA). But what if they do have 77 or higher or a gut shot, or 3 to a flush? Yeah not super terrifying but what do you do when the turn comes? What if it makes a flush draw more likely, or turns a gut shot into an open ended straight draw? What if they luck out and hit a higher set you gave them for free? Now you've not only given away a free card that is now dangerous, you've also missed a golden opportunity on the flop to have built a bigger pot to get them chasing even harder.


Overall giving away free cards is going to be a very situation specific maneuver and not one most players will advocate the vast majority of the time. By check-calling the flop here you 1.) lose potential value of a larger pot you could be building and 2.) give yourself a harder decision on the turn. A lot of players at 1/2 live tend to vastly overvalue their pocket pairs or think calling say $50 into an $100 pot is a "good price" to draw for a flush. Plus there's even competent players who thrive on mistakes of others giving them cheap draws to then exploit on the turn or river. Yeah, I get there's a specific strategy of check-calling to river when you then jam or overbet to take a pot, but what happens when you reach the river and your cards might be good but also might be now crushed? I just don't see much value in check-calling flops where we have a set , if they're raising me after I check, they're going to call my reasonably priced re-raise, why not build the pot?

Sure some players want to protect hands and shut it down when it gets scary, take the smaller pot and run. But think about your line here? It seems you wanted to let them catch something on turn, (maybe if they have AK and peel off an A on turn you get your wish) and bet into you , but why leave money on the table with a flopped set on a rainbow board? Check-raise the flop, if they come over the top you can decide if you want to go all in or fold. If they call your raise, continue the aggression, build the pot, and likely take it down.

Yeah in this specific hand, villain was playing you and trying to get max value. Somehow you got away from it, but most of the time when you flop a set on a board like this you're good to go. Might as well build a pot on each street and get as much as you can. In this sense, a free card on turn does nothing for you , if they're betting a draw or overpair or two pair on the flop, raise them and make them think you're trying to bully them out. Can't fear set over set.
 
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RakeMyLife

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You make a valid point about all factors. And you also make a good point about the texture of this board being not too scary in terms of letting free cards pop off on turn. It's not flush draw heavy, it's not really connected (although villain could have 78 or 79 and even then not too scary).

However, in considering opponents range here what might they have? We can assume they don't have AA-QQ as they're likely going to 4 bet you pre flop here anyways (although as you said, there's a lot to consider, I stacked a guy recently who thought it was a good idea to limp in with AA). But what if they do have 77 or higher or a gut shot, or 3 to a flush? Yeah not super terrifying but what do you do when the turn comes? What if it makes a flush draw more likely, or turns a gut shot into an open ended straight draw? What if they luck out and hit a higher set you gave them for free? Now you've not only given away a free card that is now dangerous, you've also missed a golden opportunity on the flop to have built a bigger pot to get them chasing even harder.


Overall giving away free cards is going to be a very situation specific maneuver and not one most players will advocate the vast majority of the time. By check-calling the flop here you 1.) lose potential value of a larger pot you could be building and 2.) give yourself a harder decision on the turn. A lot of players at 1/2 live tend to vastly overvalue their pocket pairs or think calling say $50 into an $100 pot is a "good price" to draw for a flush. Plus there's even competent players who thrive on mistakes of others giving them cheap draws to then exploit on the turn or river. Yeah, I get there's a specific strategy of check-calling to river when you then jam or overbet to take a pot, but what happens when you reach the river and your cards might be good but also might be now crushed? I just don't see much value in check-calling flops where we have a set , if they're raising me after I check, they're going to call my reasonably priced re-raise, why not build the pot?

Sure some players want to protect hands and shut it down when it gets scary, take the smaller pot and run. But think about your line here? It seems you wanted to let them catch something on turn, (maybe if they have AK and peel off an A on turn you get your wish) and bet into you , but why leave money on the table with a flopped set on a rainbow board? Check-raise the flop, if they come over the top you can decide if you want to go all in or fold. If they call your raise, continue the aggression, build the pot, and likely take it down.

Yeah in this specific hand, villain was playing you and trying to get max value. Somehow you got away from it, but most of the time when you flop a set on a board like this you're good to go. Might as well build a pot on each street and get as much as you can. In this sense, a free card on turn does nothing for you , if they're betting a draw or overpair or two pair on the flop, raise them and make them think you're trying to bully them out. Can't fear set over set.

I agree with most everything you say here! My line was indeed risky (and not one I usually take). Ironically, it helped me save my stack though, so I can't hate it completely at least in this spot. Interestingly enough, I had a very similar hand occur at my following session with 44 on a 4-9-10 flop. Played it completely differently (3 bet pre, jammed flop) and won a massive multiway pot.
 
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