$200 NLHE Full Ring: nuts faces raise on river.

BelgoSuisse

BelgoSuisse

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$200 NL HE Full Ring: nuts faces raise on river.

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 36/14/4

Comments on line could be useful. I do funny things with my cbets lately and i think it kinda works, but it sometimes looks weird.

Anyway, we have the absolute nuts on river and our value bet gets raise. How do we get the most value out of villain?

Full Tilt, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 8 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker

MP1: $259.40 (129.7 bb)
MP2: $210.95 (105.5 bb)
MP3: $200 (100 bb)
CO: $33 (16.5 bb)
BTN: $362.15 (181.1 bb)
Hero (SB): $225.35 (112.7 bb)
BB: $35.90 (18 bb)
UTG+2: $58.50 (29.3 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is SB with A
heart.gif
A
diamond.gif

5 folds, BTN calls $2, Hero raises to $10, BB folds, BTN calls $8

Flop: ($22) 9
diamond.gif
T
spade.gif
K
diamond.gif
(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $8, Hero calls $8

Turn: ($38) 2
diamond.gif
(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($38) 7
diamond.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $20, BTN raises to $55, Hero ???
 
JimmyBrizzy

JimmyBrizzy

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I would vote for a shove. I think he convinces himself that his 10-Q of diamonds is good and calls enough time for this to be profitable, and there's always the chance he could call w/ worse...

The fact that he reraises you on the river makes me think he's either bluffing or he's got something he's pretty happy with and very well may go all the way.

Also wanted to know why you decided to go with the check on the flop.
 
icemonkey9

icemonkey9

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I do think he's happy with his probable Qd card so something like KQ with the Q of diamonds seems reasonable for his hand ... he's deep stacked and a raise from $55 to $150 pretty much puts all of Belgo's chips in the pot anyways. That makes me think either a min-raise or a shove are the ONLY two options.

I have a feeling that you might have shoved and he folded, or min-raise and he flat called, making you second guess yourself. I guess I like the shove more than anything. If he has the Q of diamonds a 34/14/4 player calls figuring "well there is only ONE card that can beat me" and pays you off.

Regarding your line, bud you know I think you're better than I am ... not sure about the check-call of that board at the flop. Usually we're cbetting that, nearly pot right? At least, that's what I would have done.
 
Richyl2008

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From the stats it looks like villain is pretty aggressive. In order to extract more monies I think we have to get more money in before the river. We are missing a ton of value by not getting any money in on the turn, with all those draws out there. If you are trying to induce action, one line that might work is to ch/call flop like you did and lead the turn kind of small, which might induce a raise from his air, and possibly some draws
 
BelgoSuisse

BelgoSuisse

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I have a feeling that you might have shoved and he folded, or min-raise and he flat called, making you second guess yourself.

yeah. i shoved and he folded after hitting the time bank. in retrospect i think we may be a bit too deep here for that and a minraise might be better.

The thing is, at 100nl i used to bet 100% of boards with 4 to a flush when i had air, because that's a hugely profitable bluff when villain only calls with a flush. Insanely profitable if he only calls with good flushes.

I have the feeling a lot more people know that at 200nl, so you sometimes get called by TP hands and maybe even rebluffed by air. Against air, a shove is obviously bad, while a minreraise might induce a kamikaze shove.

Regarding your line, bud you know I think you're better than I am ...

Not better, imo. Just playing more hours lately, and that helps both for volume and for sharpening your game.

not sure about the check-call of that board at the flop. Usually we're cbetting that, nearly pot right? At least, that's what I would have done.

cbetting is standard, yes. But against aggressive villains, i like check-calling lines a lot oop.
 
BelgoSuisse

BelgoSuisse

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We are missing a ton of value by not getting any money in on the turn, with all those draws out there. If you are trying to induce action, one line that might work is to ch/call flop like you did and lead the turn kind of small, which might induce a raise from his air, and possibly some draws

Well, i don't know if I want a ton of action on turn. his stacking range there has made straights, made flushes and two pairs and maybe a few hands with Qd.
 
blankoblanco

blankoblanco

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the thing is that if you minraise he'll realize you're pretty much never bluffing. he still might make a crying call with the Qd, especially since his stats don't suggest he's good, but i wouldn't be surprised if he got away from it there too

at least if you shove he can put you on a bluff somehow, even though the reality is that almost nobody 3bet shoves this board as a bluff either. it just leaves room for that possibility where minraising pretty much doesn't, and of course you get much more $ when he looks you up that way

btw i like the rest of your line. i've played it this way vs. aggressive opponents many times myself... selective passivity ftw! if you bet flop and get raised, you're not at all happy. it's a nice way to balance your flop checking range also. i thought i was the only one who did that :p.
 
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