$200 NLHE Full Ring: Live: Top 2 and villain donks huge

Typical $1/$3 game with a few very loose players, a few nits, no one very good or capable of doing much beyond playing their cards face-up. I haven't played in a while so wondering if all my decisions are good here.

I raise to $12 with from CO over a limper. BTN, BB call, MP limper calls.

Flop: (pot $49)
Checks to me and I bet $25. BTN folds, BB calls, MP folds.

Turn: ($99)
BB thinks a bit, then fires out $100. Hero???????

Villain is a really weird guy, probably about 45. Runs a successful business. I used to think he was mentally challenged but apparently it's an act. He likes to Hollywood and pretend he doesn't know what's going on in the hand. When he really has it, he just fires out, and usually big, doesn't slowplay. Doesn't check to the raiser if he has a hand.

FWIW, my image is aggro and extremely bluffy. T9/65 definitely in his range. Don't think he'd mash the pot button with, say, pair + FD (like A7ss).

Stack sizes?

600+

The 7 meant to be a spade?

I think you have to grit your teeth and fold. Would he really bet pot with a straight though? Still think its a fold, I think he flopped a set tbh.

Well your read pretty much spells out this is how he plays it if he hits, so fold.

Otherwise its a raise..his line makes no sense. Why wouldn't he c/r a straight or set here? You had initiative, you were betting. Most of the time I face a donkbet like this I fire 3x and they fold..I wouldn't here tho due to read.

sorry should be on flop.

Poker_play said:

Well your read pretty much spells out this is how he plays it if he hits, so fold.

Otherwise its a raise..his line makes no sense. Why wouldn't he c/r a straight or set here? You had initiative, you were betting. Most of the time I face a donkbet like this I fire 3x and they fold..I wouldn't here tho due to read.

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Why would he raise a set on this flop? Such a dry flop, as for c/r the turn its dangerous. Villain would not want to risk it gettin checked through. If I have a set on the flop I c/c and then lead out the turn. As for a straight he calls the flop and and hits the turn and decides to lead out.

Also I dont like c/r much because it polarizes your range so much, it's good in mulitway pots to push out players but heads up you want value from them so a c/r can either push them out or give them a free card quite easily.

Does he bluff often?

Standard call based on stack sizes. He could have turned 2 pair, have a strong J, or combo draw at this point. This is if you think you can stack him if you fill up also. If you don't think he pays easy, then it's close. I would tend to call with position and evaluate river.

Youregoodmate..everyone plays it differently. Id imagine most villains that turned the nuts check here (c/c or c/r)..because, if turn goes check/check, you're pretty much gauranteed hero is very weak and was going to fold to your lead anyway. Checking allows hero to barrel with a lot of air/semibluffs.

Its all situation/player dependant ofc. Here he says villain fires out when he has it...so he very well could

I said that I think the straight is more unlikely but hero is behind most of the time here. TP doesnt make much sense here, I cant see him donking with it (especially considering hero's image). Even if villain has AJ why raise and risk getting re-raised instead of letting hero bluff off his stack.

Im sticking with he flopped a set.

Villain has a set or overpair here very close to 0% of the time. He doesn't bluff in spots like this either.


This hand still sort of troubles me. What's our plan for the river other than hoping to boat up?

Now that the two pair hit, all my money would be in. Let's hope he didn't flop a set.

88 (1 combo i know) 910, 65, 87 J8 all make sense given your read,
i assume you discount overpairs and sets because he didnt wet his pants pre and didnt donk lead flop?

i hate all options here really, we are deep enough to have ok implied odds if we turn a J or a 8, is he going to check alot on scary river cards?

I should say my instinct was that I should b/f $55 when the 8 came out. I was thinking that i should then consider his larger bet a raise on what I wanted to put in.

But I called and the river was

Assuming everyone will fold if he bets, what do we do if he checks?

i dont think he will fold anything better, also 65 88 78 might c/c that river. 10x still bets imo. but i still think its too thin to value bet imo

T9/67/78/88 are the hands that improved on this turn. Something like AJ could make sense, not strong enough to raise the flop but strong enough to make sure you don;t check and he gets a big sizing in.
Given the 78/AJ/Random spew possibilities, us having position and having 4 outs to improve I'm willing to call and evaluate the river.

Given the river you've been dealt I'm folding to any huge bets ~pot, calling anything decently sized (makes weaker twopair and AJ more likely as opposed to straights). If villain checks I'm bet/folding large.

So if he doesn't have AJ it's a fold? Because there's no way he has AJ.

baudib1 said:

So if he doesn't have AJ it's a fold? Because there's no way he has AJ.

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Board: Js 7c 4d 8s

Hand 0: 22.261% { Jc8c }
Hand 1: 77.739% { 88, T9s, 87s, 65s, T9o, 87o, 65o }


If the above if his range then yes but this is much easier said than done. Is villain fish? Does he raise weaker twopair on that flop (he'd need to be a fish to flop weaker two pair)? Could villain go mental and do this with a small pair (unlikely given you haven't mentioned any reads on him being a nut). He defo couldn't do this with AJ, live players think TPAK is the nuts?

Answer no to all them and you've a hero fold on your hands.

never fold the turn given stack sizes, and if he checks on the river, no point turning your hand into a bluff. check behind.

if he did bet out again on that river card, it polarises his range into whether he has the 10 or a combo flush draw on the turn that missed. easier decision then.

With the reads you gave us, I have a hard time wondering why this hand was difficult for you to fold...

bgomez89 said:

With the reads you gave us, I have a hard time wondering why this hand was difficult for you to fold...

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I HAZ TOPPEST TWO PEARS!

IDK I play bad.

This is such a fold for me. He's got a straight or set virtually 100%, just go to the next hand.

***Edit: And that was before I saw this part...When he really has it, he just fires out, and usually big, doesn't slowplay. Doesn't check to the raiser if he has a hand.

He's got it, let him have it. Live games are such easy money, don't need to force it.