$200 NLHE Full Ring: Live Poker: Attempting to bluff catch with second pair

6

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200NL live poker with $1/$3 blinds, played at a casino. Villain seems like a somewhat decent player; at least compared to your typical $1/$3 live fish. He has some knowledge of TAG strategy, some positional awareness and is capable of pulling the occasional bluff.

Hero (SB) has $200
Villain (MP) has $200
Everyone else has between $100 and $500

Hero is dealt Ks Tc

Hero (SB) posts $1
BB posts $3
UTG calls $3
2 folds
Villain (MP) calls $3
1 fold
CO calls $3
BTN calls $3
Hero (SB) raises to $26
2 folds
Villain (MP) calls $23
2 folds

~$60 in pot
Flop shows Ah Kh 6c

Hero bets $30
Villain calls $30

~$115 in pot
Turn shows 4s

Hero checks
Villain bets $55
Hero tanks then eventually calls $55

~$220 in pot
River shows 2d

Hero checks
Villain shoves ALL-IN for $90
Hero calls $90

What do you think of the way I played this hand? I was worried about Ax hands, 2 pairs and sets, but then I thought that he limp-called preflop, so his range is fairly capped. I also thought that there'd also be a lot of busted gutshots and busted flush draws in his range, so this would give me a good chance to bluff catch. Plus I thought he could've floated my Cbet with ATC to try to take it away on the turn, and when I tanked for so long on the turn, it showed weakness on my part which could've very easily induced a bluff shove on the river... Thoughts?
 
T

touchmytallalla

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he limp-calls and you say his range is fairly capped? why?
I dont like preflop. Where is sense to raise that hand out of position?
Maybe no sense to cb flop, you have showdown value and should play pot control. And you will never get pass with that cb if the player has A.
As played check/pass turn.
 
Trabendo_daze

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I honestly think the biggest mistake in this hand is made preflop. Even though you had a bunch of limpers and even though you made the raise sized for fold equity, there is a high chance you are going to go multi-way in a large pot (say $75) when you have $175 behind. You're going to be put in awkward situations like this way too often with KTo, a hand which makes decent pairs but almost never slam-dunk value hands.

I think this hand is a good example. It's just way too tricky to play in a low SPR pot OOP.

Anyways, as played you're getting a good price to call on the river, but I don't think he has that many bluffs in his range. He could have a lot of Ax (that might not bet three times for value, but also might) and could have things like A6s. A lot of possible flush draws are blocked by AhKh on the board so you're looking to bluff catch like QhJh or QhTh exactly, and those both might check back on turn. I don't think he was floating you wide on the flip There are more value combos than this.

I'm folding river, but I'm also just calling pre.
 
John A

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His range isn't capped, so not really sure what you mean. Any ways, pre-flop is your biggest mistake. I'm really surprised you didn't get more than 1 caller even though your raise was large.

I also think that if you thought your opponent was capable of bluffing that you're betting off checking the flop as opposed to betting. But that's the main issue w/ being out of position. You're in a low SPR spot w/ a mediocre hand. There's no reason to do this live when you can raise a much wider range of speculative hands in position.

You should be shoving or folding the turn, but as played if you call the turn you have to call that blank river. Ultimately you'll have a better read than what we can provide because you played it live. But I think pre I wouldn't be making these kinds of raises OP as I don't think it will do enough for your image, and usually at these stakes live image doesn't really matter too much any ways.
 
Trabendo_daze

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Yeah Matt, I was equally confused when you said his range is capped. From what I understand, "capped" means that he has very few combos that are in his range at a certain point in the hand. This is clearly not the case at the point in this hand when you said his range is capped, right? All he did was limp-call a raise in position. I would say his range is rather uncapped (there can be almost anything in it).
 
Mr Sandbag

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I'd rather limp pre. I also prefer checking flop. It's optimistic to think you're going to get called by worse when you bet flop and, unless you have a specific read, it would be profitable to check/call.

As played I think it's fine. Most players at 1/2 live would love to check back and go to showdown with Ax rather than shove.
 
6

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When I say his range is capped, I mean that he almost never has AJ+ when he limp-calls preflop. Those hands would be raising preflop. His range leans towards hands like suited Aces, suited connectors and pocket pairs when he limp-calls such a large preflop raise.

So when the flop comes AK6, there's only 5 realistic combos of strong hands he can have: 2 combos of A6s and 3 combos of 66. I don't think that K6 is ever calling this large preflop raise and I don't think that AA, KK and AK are ever limp-calling preflop. I also don't think that AJ and AQ are ever limp-calling preflop, which means he almost never has TPGK either.

So when he bets this hard postflop (calls $30 flop bet, bets $55 on turn and shoves $90 on river), I think that it's actually fairly difficult for him to have Ax here. Is a hand like A9s really going to play this aggressively, or will he instead check back the turn for pot control?
 
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k10off seems a bit overly ambitious, you turn your hand face up as a one pair hand when you check call the turn. I'm guessing he mostly has axs hands here, a set is possible, but only 66.
 
6

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k10off seems a bit overly ambitious, you turn your hand face up as a one pair hand when you check call the turn. I'm guessing he mostly has axs hands here, a set is possible, but only 66.

Preflop was basically a bluff squeeze. I can represent much stronger hands than they can when they take the limp-call line. And I'd much rather take the initiative with a hand like KTo than play a MW pot without the initiative.

How does check-calling the turn narrow my hand range down to 1 pair hands? I could easily have a flush draw instead, possibly even a gutshot. Maybe I have bottom 2 pairs and decided to go into scared nit mode?

And if check-calling the turn is indicative of weakness, then doesn't that make the river check-call line even more necessary? Since I've essentially induced a bluff by expressing weakness on the turn?

I explained the Ax thing in the post above. How often does a villain at $1/$3 decide to take the call/bet/shove line with TPBK? I know he doesn't have TPGK because he limp-called preflop and I just felt that he's never going to play TPBK that aggressively.
 
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I don't see you raising a6ss enough to really put that in your range, if it's there it would be a miss range valuation on my part, and this is because it is going to be a difficult hand to play OOp even with initiative. I see most players would just hope they dominate other peoples suits and be happy to play good multi-way hand.

A lot of players double barrel flush draws most of the time, sure you could have a gutshot, but can that be a profitable call in this spot? I don't see anyone not 2 barreling out of position here with top bottom, just seems like giving up to much value, and it isn't like the hand isn't easily beatable by the river. Your right he doesn't take that line often with tpbk, but I wouldn't be shocked if he hit a6 or a4s. There is a small percentage he turns his hand into a bluff, unlikely, definitely, but still a mere possibility.
 
WVHillbilly

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Villain seems like a somewhat decent player; at least compared to your typical $1/$3 live fish. He has some knowledge of TAG strategy, some positional awareness and is capable of pulling the occasional bluff
The guy described here doesn't generally limp/call preflop/
 
Mr Sandbag

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Is a hand like A9s really going to play this aggressively, or will he instead check back the turn for pot control?

No he can pretty safely value bet turn with any Ax hand. But not many players are capable of shoving river for value with Ax, even for only $90.
 
6

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The guy described here doesn't generally limp/call preflop/

I never said he was a perfect player, but he is an above-average $1/$3 live player. He understands which hands perform well in multiway pots and which hands perform well in heads up pots, and he raises and limps accordingly, knowing that there aren't many players on a $1/$3 table that will exploit him for doing so.

No he can pretty safely value bet turn with any Ax hand. But not many players are capable of shoving river for value with Ax, even for only $90.

This is $1/$3 not $5/$10. No one at these stakes knows how to thin value bet. He just wants to reach showdown cheaply with TPBK hands.

Results:
The villain had Jh Th (busted flush draw and busted gutshot).
Hero won the $390 pot.
 
Mr Sandbag

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This is $1/$3 not $5/$10. No one at these stakes knows how to thin value bet. He just wants to reach showdown cheaply with TPBK hands.

I disagree. It's not even thin. When you check back turn it's obvious to even the worst players that you don't have Ax or better.
 
Trabendo_daze

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+1 to all of Sand's logic here. The board is totally safe for an Ax value bet.
 
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