$200 NLHE Full Ring: $1-$2 live, nit bombs river, 2 hands

nits always have it right? Two different villains but both are about the same...unimaginative live nits. In first hand, PFR is the same type -- he has an overpair here 100%.

Action:
Hero is BTN with

UTG ($300) raises to $12, 1 call, Hero ($450) calls on BTN, BB ($350) calls.

Flop (4 players, $49)
BB checks, UTG bets $35, 2 folds, Hero calls, BB calls.

Turn (3 players, $154)
BB checks, UTG bets $80, Hero calls, BB calls.

River (3 players, $394)
BB Bets $200, UTG folds, Hero???

Hand 2:
Hero is UTG+1 with
UTG limps for $2, Hero raises to $15, MP calls, all fold.

Flop (3 players, $48):
UTG checks, Hero bets $27, MP folds, UTG calls.

Turn (2 players, $102):
UTG checks, Hero bets $75, UTG calls

River (2 players, $252):
UTG bets $150, Hero????

Hand 1 I'd have to call, I can't see a live nit having any sort of SD on the flop that morphs into a combo on the turn and I couldn't put him on AhJh exactly either.

Hand 2 is more problematic, had just about the same hand tonite. I think it is more likely that villain has a set here and puts you on exactly the hand you have.

Hand 1 I fold, hand 2 I call if villain has shown he is donking TPTK/2pr in this spot which is also unlikely. I would treat 200nl live as I would microstakes online meaning this is almost always the nuts in both hands especially if you've already singled them out as unimaginative nits.

Also hand 1 is an easy shove on the turn, 89 is insanely concealed and you're definately getting called by huge number of worse hands.

EDIT - Actually hand 1 I call, I can conceivably see a fishy nit playing a set like this.

I figured it was the other way APA? hand 1's a call/shove since villain has more sets in his range than BDFD's..

hand 2 as played he always has sets really, don't see nits limp calling A8s UTG right so sigh fold.

Sorry bit tired, yarp hand 2 fold. Unless you've seen villain limp AK before in which case call.

i think hand 1 is a fold im pretty sure he turns up with AJhh QJhh most of the time i dont see sets or chops playing like this from a live nit. i think hand 2 is grosser and probably a fold, i think you see AKhh AJhh A10hh a ton here and rarely if ever sets.

duggs said:

i think hand 1 is a fold im pretty sure he turns up with AJhh QJhh most of the time i dont see sets or chops playing like this from a live nit. i think hand 2 is grosser and probably a fold, i think you see AKhh AJhh A10hh a ton here and rarely if ever sets.

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Why is no one saying to raise the turn in hand one?

Hand 1 raise turn. If he has a set he ain't folding.

Hand 2 I would check back turn. Maybe go for a small river value bet.


As played though, I think hand 1 is a call and hand 2 is a fold.

because UTG range is like QQ+ and it will all bet/fold but triple the river and the bb has a weak range that wont sustain a raise.

duggs said:

because UTG range is like QQ+ and it will all bet/fold but triple the river and the bb has a weak range that wont sustain a raise.

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I don't understand, you're saying not to raise the turn to protect your hand because he'll fold?

atlantafalcons0 said:

Why is no one saying to raise the turn in hand one?

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AlwaysPlanAhe said:

Also hand 1 is an easy shove on the turn, 89 is insanely concealed and you're definately getting called by huge number of worse hands.

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Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

AlwaysPlanAhe said:

Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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Oh ok, I missed that.

At least there's someone who sees it from my perspective.

Thanks.

Thinking about it more makes me think that BB in hand 1 is more likely to have the flush than a set. Why would he call the turn with a set, from his perspective the board would have gotten a lot worse for his hand at it is likely that BTN could have AJhh/KJhh/QJhh. I think the only time a nit flats is if he has one of those hands.

Think hand 1 is a fold now, unless you have reads that he slowplays sets into oblivion in which case call.

Makes a more compelling case for a turn raise/shove.

Hand 1 i see only AhJh,maybe QhJh in his range.
Hand 2 It's prob a set of 8's,Q's, or maybe AQ
hand 1 i fold, hand 2 in game i prob call and regret it.

Hand 1, nits don't have QhJh here, they fold that complaining about having to fold such pretty cards.

I think I should clarify what a live nit is...there's probably very very few people who play a true online nit style...online you have real regs who play 9/8 or something. Live it's more like they are tight passive, they play 18/3 with a 3-bet of 1%. Yes they are that LOL.

I play bad so in Hand 1 I told the guy I put him on exactly King-jack of hearts and paid him anyway -- he had KJ hearts. On 2nd hand I told the guy, "I guess you have Jack-Ten of hearts." Boy was I wrong as he had J9 of hearts.

I actualy have a question for baudib. It is payed more passively to reduce variance? I know that live you do not have the luxury to play a big sample so luck even eventually and if you loose a buy-in you probabely do not make it back the same night. But i saw pros on TV and they are even more agressive live than online. Probabely they have the skill to read faces witch probabely increase their winning rated.

I don't understand the question...There are plenty of games where you don't really get going until you drop 2-3 buyins.

baudib1 said:

I don't understand the question...There are plenty of games where you don't really get going until you drop 2-3 buyins.

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I read my post again and I saw that I eate some letters My damn keyboard.

"It is played more passively to reduce variance?

what is? well, no.

Hand 2 super-easy fold. Hand 1 definitely raise turn as played it really depends if he's a live donk who doesn't realize his bet is actually only half pot or whether he does realize this. If he thinks he's betting big (aka omg 200 DOLLARZ) I think it's a fold if he thinks he's betting on the small side (half pot bet) I call.

On hand 1, is there any good reason why not to raise?

Why does everyone want to give 2 nits a chance to fold their 1-pair hands?

baudib1 said:

Why does everyone want to give 2 nits a chance to fold their 1-pair hands?

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Would they play sets differently?

UTG has QQ+ and BB never has a set.