$20 NLHE 6-max: small flush on paired board vs fish.

forsakenone

forsakenone

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villain is 66/26/1 on 38 hands. UTG limper was also a fish and I raised so small because I figured the reg on SB will fold for 3x anyway if he doesn't plan on playing.

888 Poker - $0.20 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

CO: $14.51
Hero (BTN): $20.00
SB: $20.66
BB: $10.95
UTG: $12.39
MP: $22.15

SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.20

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.30) Hero has 5:diamond: 7:diamond:

UTG calls $0.20, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.60, fold, BB calls $0.40, UTG calls $0.40

Flop: ($1.90, 3 players) T:heart: 3:diamond: T:diamond:
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $1.20, BB calls $1.20, UTG calls $1.20

Turn: ($5.50, 3 players) 8:diamond:
BB bets $2.75, fold, Hero calls $2.75

River: ($11.00, 2 players) 4:heart:
BB bets $6.40, Hero calls $6.40

can I lay this down?
villain hasn't been particularly agro, more of a calling station.
 
fletchdad

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It is hard to say vs this kind of fish. but I see players like this at 888 doing this when the FD comes in, cause they want their 2P-trips to be GOOD HERE, so I AM BETTING... if you know what I mean.

I guess I am calling here, since he has a lot of 2P/trips. Does he ONLY c/c OTT OTR so far OOP? If so, maybe a fold is a lot easier than I first thought....
 
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AlwaysPlanAhe

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Villain has better flush or full house. Call turn, fold river.
 
Deco

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Im never folding here his lack of tx hands preflop is all that keeps me from min raising the river.

I limp behind preflop im happy to iso this hand vs a full stacked fish, against a half stack I just limp.
 
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AlwaysPlanAhe

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Im never folding here his lack of tx hands preflop is all that keeps me from min raising the river.

I limp behind preflop im happy to iso this hand vs a full stacked fish, against a half stack I just limp.

No way a passive calling station double barrels into a 3-way pot on a paired 3 to a flush board without having a baby flush beat. Villains preflop stats are ridiculous but his postflop actions are nutted.
 
Deco

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I thought villain was a reg dunno why I missed the stats. This is a fistpump shove I raise the turn though. Folding this is like the worst thing ever.
 
ChuckTs

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No way a passive calling station double barrels into a 3-way pot on a paired 3 to a flush board without having a baby flush beat. Villains preflop stats are ridiculous but his postflop actions are nutted.

38 hands to me isn't enough to say he's passive enough not completely retarded and has slowplayed overpairs and backdoor draws and won't fold trips and won't fold a pair+draw etc etc etc. He also didn't double barrel into a 3way pot, it got heads up on the turn.

I raise turn and shove river almost always here.
 
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AlwaysPlanAhe

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I am sooo tired today it hurts but I'll post my reasoning tomorrow. OP if you could postpone revealing the results of the hand quite yet I would appreciate it very much :)

EDIT - In fact this is what I'll do. I will narrow villains range down to 1 of only 2 possible hands and explain why I think it's one of these 2 hands. If I'm correct then I stand by my decision to fold river. If I'm wrong then I will admit that I suck at poker big time and will concede that you guys are correct.
 
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Deco

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I am sooo tired today it hurts but I'll post my reasoning tomorrow. OP if you could postpone revealing the results of the hand quite yet I would appreciate it very much :)

EDIT - In fact this is what I'll do. I will narrow villains range down to 1 of only 2 possible hands and explain why I think it's one of these 2 hands. If I'm correct then I stand by my decision to fold river. If I'm wrong then I will admit that I suck at poker big time and will concede that you guys are correct.

This is dumb. OP called its obvious villain had 88 or a higher flush or this hand wouldn't be posted. Its why I ask people to leave out their last action.

Despite knowing op lost the hand I know he lost value by not shoving. Base your decisons on villains range not on whether we won or lost against one of his many holdings.
 
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AlwaysPlanAhe

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This is dumb. OP called its obvious villain had 88 or a higher flush or this hand wouldn't be posted. Its why I ask people to leave out their last action.

Despite knowing op lost the hand I know he lost value by not shoving. Base your decisons on villains range not on whether we won or lost against one of his many holdings.

Shoving the river is dumb. I'm aware that hero is beat and I wasn't going to state the insanely obvious 2 hands it could be based on that and you're very wrong when you said 88 or higher flush btw. But I'm very curious as to why you said 88...
 
forsakenone

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For the record I don't always post hands that I loose.
 
Deco

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Im not even talking about the hand here. Im saying judging that the hand was/was not played well based on the result is dumb.
 
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AlwaysPlanAhe

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For the record I don't always post hands that I loose.

Yes but you said, "Can I ever get away from this" indicating you called down and lost. I'm going to PM you my breakdown of the hand when I get back from the library later. I'm hoping it leads to an interesting discussion because fwiw although I still think we're losing to villains range i'm probably still calling and thinking, "I'm calling because I have a flush and **** you".

Im not even talking about the hand here. Im saying judging that the hand was/was not played well based on the result is dumb.

If you're not at all interested in what I've got to say then it's your loss. Having a closed mind will only serve to stunt your poker growth not mine. I am more than willing to accept when I'm wrong, I also enjoy poker related conversations where my opinion of a hand differs from someone elses and talking about it improves both players without it descended into, "you're idea's dumb because I'm right". I know what your take on the hand is, we're ahead of villains range on the turn so raise/shove, or we're ahead on the river so raise/shove. You're basically saying we're ahead of villains entire range so shove...I'm perfectly aware of that but I think you're wrong and I have reasons that aren't results orientated. Also I would like to share them without someone with a big ego saying it's dumb before even hearing the rationale. (regardless of how dumb you think it is)
 
xdeucesx

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If you plan on being this passive w/baby flushes and folding them on these boards, don't even bother playing them preflop. Your not going to get much better then above w/75s, so you need to be able to get max value if your going to play it. Folding this river is straight up just lighting $ on fire.
 
WVHillbilly

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Raise the turn and try to get it in. Why did you just flat there?
 
fletchdad

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Since I have read posts and analysis from both Deco and APA that I thought very read-worthy, maybe you could both continue your thoughts - on the hand lol - ITT.
 
Deco

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OP if you could postpone revealing the results of the hand quite yet I would appreciate it very much :)

EDIT - In fact this is what I'll do. I will narrow villains range down to 1 of only 2 possible hands and explain why I think it's one of these 2 hands. If I'm correct then I stand by my decision to fold river. If I'm wrong then I will admit that I suck at poker big time and will concede that you guys are correct.


Im not even talking about the hand here. Im saying judging that the hand was/was not played well based on the result is dumb.

If you're not at all interested in what I've got to say then it's your loss. Having a closed mind will only serve to stunt your poker growth not mine. I am more than willing to accept when I'm wrong, I also enjoy poker related conversations where my opinion of a hand differs from someone elses and talking about it improves both players without it descended into, "you're idea's dumb because I'm right". I know what your take on the hand is, we're ahead of villains range on the turn so raise/shove, or we're ahead on the river so raise/shove. You're basically saying we're ahead of villains entire range so shove...I'm perfectly aware of that but I think you're wrong and I have reasons that aren't results orientated. Also I would like to share them without someone with a big ego saying it's dumb before even hearing the rationale. (regardless of how dumb you think it is)

..
 
youregoodmate

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Haha that last post is brilliant ^

Deco is right, OP obviously lost the hand that doesn't change any decision we should have made.

I GII OTT and am more than happy about it, as played def raising the river.
 
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