$20 NLHE 6-max: 20NL, Turned straight, river pairs + flushes board, Vil raises

M

mr_kommpa

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SB: $25.35 (126.8 bb)
BB: $16.54 (82.7 bb)
Hero (UTG): $20 (100 bb)
MP: $14.06 (70.3 bb)
CO: $19 (95 bb)
BTN: $20.18 (100.9 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J
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A
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Hero raises to $0.60, MP folds, CO calls $0.60, 2 folds, BB calls $0.40

Flop: ($1.90) 8
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Q
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T
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(3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1, CO calls $1, BB calls $1

Turn: ($4.90) K
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(3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $2.60, CO calls $2.60, BB calls $2.60

River: ($12.70) 8
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(3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $4.20, CO raises to $14.80 and is all-in, BB folds, Hero???

Both are unknown, Their stats after 10 hands is sort of passive and because I have played with almost every reg on the site I assume they are fishes.

The flop Cbets seems super standard and on the turn maybe I could bet a little bigger but the king was a scary card and I didnt want to blow them out of the water, didnt expect both opponent to continue.

The river bet is questionable, I just felt like a bet would get called by worse that would check it down otherwise, they are fishes but I didnt think they would call an all-in with worse. so... what should I do when raised? :eek:
 
IPlay

IPlay

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WP IMO. I do think we can bet turn larger. Lots of Jx from the flop that have improved to open enders.
 
PokerNuts01

PokerNuts01

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Scary river .. runer runer flush is complete lol.. i think fold is the best option here
 
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MrGreen13

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I agree with you, the river bet is questionable I prefer check/call.
As played I think that is a crying fold in the river, because I dont believe that the villain will makes this move with many bluffs.
 
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mr_kommpa

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WP IMO. I do think we can bet turn larger. Lots of Jx from the flop that have improved to open enders.

yeah, should probably bet a little bigger. I just started taking shots at 20NL so I am used to betting about 1/2 pot when the pot is €5 , but I should probably have bet 2/3 or something simillar. Anyways, what do you think about the river?
 
IPlay

IPlay

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yeah, should probably bet a little bigger. I just started taking shots at 20NL so I am used to betting about 1/2 pot when the pot is €5 , but I should probably have bet 2/3 or something simillar. Anyways, what do you think about the river?

I think that sizing is usually fine on most turns but this hand we turn the nuts 3 way and the card that gives us the nuts gives villains straight draws/flush draws and 2 pair. So we can size up a little bigger. Bet/folding river is honestly a little thin, as sick as that sounds but good. I don't think we get too much value from checking to induce bluffs so your line is probably more EV then checking.

Also with check/calling what if they bet 75%? Tough spot with our exact hand and I don't think we can fold so betting also lets us set the price and gets value from hands that will check back.
 
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mr_kommpa

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I have not been analysing this hand but there are not a lot of hands that they "should" have that beat me here. there are some flushes with pairs or straight draws and some two pairs / sets that improved to full house.
I do agree that a fold would probably be best but there are some merits to calling as well. Fishes usually pay attention to their absolute strength and not there relative strength. My absolute strength is strong so maybe they could raise me with worse hands that still have a strong absolute strength? I only need 25% to call so as long as they could have something like AK, KQ KT, QT, J9 I should be good here, and that is a good amout of combos, but also might be totally wrong.
 
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IPlay

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Hard to imagine J9 slow playing to the river and then jamming on this awful run out, same with QT/KT. KQ spew is possible but still pretty unlikely. I'd also discount AK quite a bit for the same reasons. Not raising pre, calling turn, not raising turn and then jamming river makes AK pretty unlikely, but possible.
 
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mr_kommpa

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Yeah, I agree. It was probably a fold, I ended up calling and he showed J8o. So he played it very weird but he did have an OESD on the turn and improved to three of a kind on the river. I think in the long run its leaning towards a fold but I dont think a call is that bad. I ended the session pretty quickly afterwards because I didnt really think through the call and that kind of threw me off my game :)
 
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KFlint

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God it's hard reading fish, I would have folded here I think. He really thinks he's going for value here, oh my...
 
Sil3ntness

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I would have to fold, getting raised 3 way on the river after firing three barrels when flush comes just seems a bit too strong unless we have good read on the aggressive villain.
 
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