$2 NLHE Full Ring: TT flush draw on turn

V

vivman1107

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Winning Poker, Hold'em No Limit - $0.01/$0.02 - 9 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

UTG: $2.00 (100 bb)
UTG+1: $0.52 (26 bb)
MP: $6.65 (333 bb)
MP+1: $2.09 (105 bb)
LP (Hero): $2.33 (117 bb)
CO: $1.43 (72 bb)
BU: $2.29 (115 bb)
SB: $2.10 (105 bb)
BB: $2.12 (106 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.03) Hero is LP with T T
UTG raises to $0.06, 2 players fold, MP+1 calls $0.06, Hero calls $0.06, 4 players fold

Flop: ($0.21) 4 3 4 (3 players)
UTG checks, MP+1 checks, Hero bets $0.21, UTG folds, MP+1 calls $0.21

Turn: ($0.63) Q (2 players)
MP+1 checks, Hero bets $0.63, MP+1 raises to $1.82 (all-in), Hero calls $1.19

Hi. This is my first post so please go easy on me. I played for a short while a few years ago at micro stakes and just got back in a few days ago. I've been doing a lot of reading and watching videos and controlled aggression seems to be the common thread.

Against this villain, was I too aggressive on the turn? When this villain 3bet shoves, should I fold more often?

Villain stats: VPIP - 13, PFR - 0, AF - 0.3
 
pandaboy

pandaboy

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After check raise turn. What kind of hands do u want to see ? What hands can be check push ? How many times vpip 13 will be blef here ?! I prefer here to bet 0.18 flop and check turn.
 
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quant1986

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Turn bet size is way too big and villain would fold most hands you dominuted but continued with strong holdings

micro stakes I don't see villains check raised turn with bluff when facing pot size bet
 
Aballinamion

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Line: Overplaying Value Hand OTT versus Ultra Passive Villain

Winning Poker, Hold'em No Limit - $0.01/$0.02 - 9 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

UTG: $2.00 (100 bb)
UTG+1: $0.52 (26 bb)
MP: $6.65 (333 bb)
MP+1: $2.09 (105 bb)
LP (Hero): $2.33 (117 bb)
CO: $1.43 (72 bb)
BU: $2.29 (115 bb)
SB: $2.10 (105 bb)
BB: $2.12 (106 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.03) Hero is LP with T T
UTG raises to $0.06, 2 players fold, MP+1 calls $0.06, Hero calls $0.06, 4 players fold

Flop: ($0.21) 4 3 4 (3 players)
UTG checks, MP+1 checks, Hero bets $0.21, UTG folds, MP+1 calls $0.21

Turn: ($0.63) Q (2 players)
MP+1 checks, Hero bets $0.63, MP+1 raises to $1.82 (all-in), Hero calls $1.19

Hi. This is my first post so please go easy on me. I played for a short while a few years ago at micro stakes and just got back in a few days ago. I've been doing a lot of reading and watching videos and controlled aggression seems to be the common thread.

Against this villain, was I too aggressive on the turn? When this villain 3bet shoves, should I fold more often?

Villain stats: VPIP - 13, PFR - 0, AF - 0.3

Hello there vivman1107, very welcome to the CardsChat community and thanks a lot for sharing your hand. Lemme tryna help ya, shall we?

The Preflop

TT is not a good candidate to be calling here to play a Multi-Way-Pot (with more than 2 players involved on the pot). Why? Because if it comes a Jx, Qx, Kx and Ax, we are almost forced to pay at least one street of value, knowing that we are losing and when it comes more than one overcard OTF and we hit a set on the turn or river, our set sometimes will complete straights or even flushes.
Besides, we are out of position, CO, BTN, SB and BB are yet to speak, and this reduces our equity very much. We are calling here with TT simply to hit a set and this is not profitable, for the times players IP call ahead, or many players enter into the pot, or someone Squeezes ahead, what is our plan keep calling to play a huge pot with a hand that can be very dominated for Squeezing ranges? Maybe not.

the postflop

The Flop

Luckily we got position and players did not c-bet, which it could be a good sign ever since hands like JJ, QQ, KK and AA that don't have a spades on its combos would be c-betting flops like this 100% of times, and even when these pocket pairs have one spades on its combos they are also betting.
Our concern about these hands is the UTG, because MP-1 will not display here JJ, QQ, KK and AA, because it would be 3-betting preflop versus UTG's strong ranges that almost always calls and 4-bets.
The flop comes low and we make a c-bet of 100% pot, which is not very good for us, since we are making the pot grow for no other reason, just because we have TT and a weak Back Door Flush.
Given the fact that MP+1 called it will have more flush draws and 33, 44 than us, but they are just a few combos.

The Turn

Not a good card for our range since Villain called 100% c-bet flop out of position and this turn completes a lot of MP+1 bluffs: for example some AQ that it decided to call preflop now is ahead, its flush draws that called OTF now completed and we have only Back Door Flush with a weak kicker (Ts), and MP+1 still can display 33 and 44 that are hands that could be calling 100% flop.
When we do bet 100% on the turn, we are overplaying our hand very much, because we have no QQ and sometimes not even AQ on our range, we do not have a made nut flush because if we had it we would be bluffing it in a very complicated texture where it doubled paired on the flop and we could be already dead.
When we do bet 100% pot on a Turn like this we should have no bluffs, either we do have a full-house, a quads or a nutted flush because there are many hands that could be ahead right now.
Given the stats of your Villain, I believe it would never be lying/bluffing on a scenario like this and its bluffs are strong value hands such as AQ, even QQ (the guy never raises preflop), flushes, full-houses, four of a kind, you name it.

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa
 
Vallet

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You drew a flush by placing a big bet on the turn. But I think you're far behind because you got a re-raise. The opponent can have a high flush or full house.
 
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hcuervo

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A question aggressive play is a good strategy for the game, since they throw you fast or you make a big pot, it is necessary to always be aggressive or always controlled
 
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hcuervo

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You drew a flush by placing a big bet on the turn. But I think you're far behind because you got a re-raise. The opponent can have a high flush or full house.
Valgame God with the increases in the games that have color is the most difficult thing to guess the major card of your opponents as long as you do not have the ace matador, there it turns extremely Easy and fun:D
 
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vivman1107

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Hello there vivman1107, very welcome to the CardsChat community and thanks a lot for sharing your hand. Lemme tryna help ya, shall we?

The Preflop

TT is not a good candidate to be calling here to play a Multi-Way-Pot (with more than 2 players involved on the pot). Why? Because if it comes a Jx, Qx, Kx and Ax, we are almost forced to pay at least one street of value, knowing that we are losing and when it comes more than one overcard OTF and we hit a set on the turn or river, our set sometimes will complete straights or even flushes.
Besides, we are out of position, CO, BTN, SB and BB are yet to speak, and this reduces our equity very much. We are calling here with TT simply to hit a set and this is not profitable, for the times players IP call ahead, or many players enter into the pot, or someone Squeezes ahead, what is our plan keep calling to play a huge pot with a hand that can be very dominated for Squeezing ranges? Maybe not.

the postflop

The Flop

Luckily we got position and players did not c-bet, which it could be a good sign ever since hands like JJ, QQ, KK and AA that don't have a spades on its combos would be c-betting flops like this 100% of times, and even when these pocket pairs have one spades on its combos they are also betting.
Our concern about these hands is the UTG, because MP-1 will not display here JJ, QQ, KK and AA, because it would be 3-betting preflop versus UTG's strong ranges that almost always calls and 4-bets.
The flop comes low and we make a c-bet of 100% pot, which is not very good for us, since we are making the pot grow for no other reason, just because we have TT and a weak Back Door Flush.
Given the fact that MP+1 called it will have more flush draws and 33, 44 than us, but they are just a few combos.

The Turn

Not a good card for our range since Villain called 100% c-bet flop out of position and this turn completes a lot of MP+1 bluffs: for example some AQ that it decided to call preflop now is ahead, its flush draws that called OTF now completed and we have only Back Door Flush with a weak kicker (Ts), and MP+1 still can display 33 and 44 that are hands that could be calling 100% flop.
When we do bet 100% on the turn, we are overplaying our hand very much, because we have no QQ and sometimes not even AQ on our range, we do not have a made nut flush because if we had it we would be bluffing it in a very complicated texture where it doubled paired on the flop and we could be already dead.
When we do bet 100% pot on a Turn like this we should have no bluffs, either we do have a full-house, a quads or a nutted flush because there are many hands that could be ahead right now.
Given the stats of your Villain, I believe it would never be lying/bluffing on a scenario like this and its bluffs are strong value hands such as AQ, even QQ (the guy never raises preflop), flushes, full-houses, four of a kind, you name it.

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa

Thanks so much for the insightful reply. I think I have not been taking into account some of the factors you described during my play but it is something I will try to work on.
 
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maxi_j

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Postflop sizing too big. Turn - easy fold.
 
C

Casey55

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On the flop I like a check, Villain has the over-pairs since he was the pre-flop aggressor from early position, if we bet on the flop and villain check-raises we will not be happy.


I think the turn is a check, villain is calling your flop with broad-way suited-spade hands and PP, the Q of spades nails his calling range and brings over-card to your TT turn is a check for me get closer to showdown.

As played I think turn is easy fold, but I would focus more on your play that got you to that ugly spot don’t just focus on your decision when he shoves.
 
Last edited:
Vallet

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Valgame God with the increases in the games that have color is the most difficult thing to guess the major card of your opponents as long as you do not have the ace matador, there it turns extremely Easy and fun:D
The main task is to determine the range of the opponent's cards during the hand. Most of the players who make re-raise have the best cards. We can only speculate now.
 
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hcuervo

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The main task is to determine the range of the front cards during the hand. Most of the players who make re-raise have the best cards. We can only speculate now.
If you totally agree if they increase it is because they are supposed to have the highest card. I love the answer it's just speculation:D
 
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fundiver199

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Preflop
Fine with calling behind with TT.

Flop
Like betting when checked to, but full pot is extremely large on a paired board. Modern game theory would suggest a very small bet like 1/3 pot, and even adjusting for the fact, this is 2NL, I would not go larger than a standard 50-65% pot bet.

Turn
Qs was a terrible card, so I prefer to check behind. Instead you bet full pot again, and I dont really understand why? Are you trying to get a better hand to fold or get called by worse? As played you should fold to his raise. You have a bad pair and a bad draw, and this is not the kind of hand, you want to stack off with.

Hope this was easy enough on you and welcome to the forum :)
 
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zuker

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To reveal MP1 range i would like to see his CallOpen stat.
Is there only pairs for setmine or suited hands like Axs?
Your betsizing is pretty big. Your hand is not the best and you have to pot control.
 
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