$2 NLHE Full Ring: Flop straight vs 2 villains, help with bet sizing please

No real reads on the opponents apart from the fact that they don't like to fold, obviously I am aiming to have everything in by the river, and hopefully to bring both of them along for the ride.

Poker Stars - $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em (7 players)
Poker Stars Hand Converter Tool from CardsChat.com

SB: $1.08
BB: $1.43
UTG: $5.35
MP: $2.26
MP+1: $0.83
CO: $0.90
BTN Hero: $2.42
realUAplayer - Sitting Out

Pre-flop: ($0.03) Hero is BTN and dealt
UTG folds, MP calls $0.02, MP+1 calls $0.02, CO folds, Hero calls $0.02, SB folds, BB checks

Flop: ($0.09) (4 players)
BB bets $0.02, MP folds

What next?

raise or fold pre, as played raise to like 14 cents.

Raise preflop. As played pot it, 15 cents I think.

Why haven't you raised PF on the button?

As played, I just 10c bet (pot bet), not sure why we are over betting pot billy/baudib?

Obviously there is a reason you are both saying to over bet the pot and you most likely are both right here, but I'm intrigued as to why we over bet the pot?

We want callers dont we? I'm sure pot betting even 3/4 betting will get callers from anyone who has a piece. Overbetting just drives everyone away most times. We can't be outdrawn, unless someone is holding A.K which is highly unlikely even then they need the 10.


EDIT: Sorry didn't see BB donk min bet which makes the pot 12c. Ok again though, I just repop another 11c/12c in to the pot to make a nice pot on the turn.

Yeah what's your reasoning for not raising pre?

ramdeebam said:

Why haven't you raised PF on the button?

As played, I just 10c bet (pot bet), not sure why we are over betting pot billy/baudib?

Obviously there is a reason you are both saying to over bet the pot and you most likely are both right here, but I'm intrigued as to why we over bet the pot?

We want callers dont we? I'm sure pot betting even 3/4 betting will get callers from anyone who has a piece. Overbetting just drives everyone away most times. We can't be outdrawn, unless someone is holding A.K which is highly unlikely even then they need the 10.


EDIT: Sorry didn't see BB donk min bet which makes the pot 12c. Ok again though, I just repop another 11c/12c in to the pot to make a nice pot on the turn.

Click to expand...

Pot is 11c and it's 2c to call so a pot sized raised is actually our 2c to call + 13c or 15c.

Also this is a board that hits lots of loose limpy ranges. Plenty of 1 pair + draw type hands that aren't going anywhere and since we failed to do anything preflop we need to build the pot as much as possible now. I'm literally going pot/pot/pot here if allowed.

you want to get as much money in as possible while the board still looks good to someone with JT/QT/QJ type hands.

bgomez89 said:

Yeah what's your reasoning for not raising pre?

Click to expand...

Firstly I'm a coward, secondly it's not a great hand and thirdly I'm a fish


Poker Stars - $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em (7 players)
Poker Stars Hand Converter Tool from CardsChat.com


SB: $1.08
BB: $1.43
UTG: $5.35
MP: $2.26
MP+1: $0.83
CO: $0.90
BTN Hero: $2.42
realUAplayer - Sitting Out


Pre-flop: ($0.03) Hero is BTN and dealt
UTG folds, MP calls $0.02, MP+1 calls $0.02, CO folds, Hero calls $0.02, SB folds, BB checks


Flop: ($0.09) (4 players)
BB bets $0.02, MP folds, MP+1 raises to $0.04, Hero raises to $0.10, BB raises to $0.16, MP+1 calls $0.12, Hero raises to $0.50, BB calls $0.34, MP+1 calls $0.34


Turn: ($1.59) (3 players)
BB checks, MP+1 checks

OK so I should have raised PF, I should have bet more post-flop, what now please? Potentially I am up against a flush draw now, so presumably I should shove?

You shove now because stack sizes dictate it, NOT because you think they might have a BDFD. You put the bigger stack all-in because the pot is $1.50 and the bigger of the 2 stacks has less than $1 left.

Think value not OMG I might somehow get beat!!!

WVHillbilly said:

Think value not OMG I might somehow get beat!!!

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Sorry, I am trying to change my mindset, but it's taking time

At the moment I'm trying to get my head around bet sizing, too, and it's quite complex.

The pot is like $1.59 and neither of them have more than 92 cents? just shove turn.

F4STFORW4RD said:

Sorry, I am trying to change my mindset, but it's taking time

At the moment I'm trying to get my head around bet sizing, too, and it's quite complex.

Click to expand...

It is, especially when you're playing full stacked and have to think about 3 streets but the better you get at it now the bigger the advantage you'll have over your opponents.

@fastfoward, what are you afraid of? Also KT is a great hand to iso with here in this situation

bgomez89 said:

@fastfoward, what are you afraid of? Also KT is a great hand to iso with here in this situation

Click to expand...

Probably don't have the bankroll that I should, haven't got a clue what I'm doing, trying to take in about twenty things at once and trying to make some sort of sense of it all. Way out of my depth

I tend to think of KT as a marginal hand...

F4STFORW4RD said:

Probably don't have the bankroll that I should, haven't got a clue what I'm doing, trying to take in about twenty things at once and trying to make some sort of sense of it all. Way out of my depth

I tend to think of KT as a marginal hand...

Click to expand...

It is in absolute value but who cares you're on the button with a few limpers. Your cards are almost irrelevant these people want to give you their money, make sure you get the max from them.

Here are a couple of hands I played last night at Cake (4nl):
Cake - $0.04 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $3.72
UTG: $10.58
UTG+1: $4.65
MP: $1.42
MP+1: $3.94
LP: $4.82
CO: $4.00
Hero (BTN): $4.41
SB: $2.58

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04, CO posts DB $0.04

Pre Flop: ($0.10) Hero has 8:spade: K:club:

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 calls $0.04, fold, CO checks, Hero raises to $0.22, SB calls $0.20, fold, fold, fold

Flop: ($0.56, 2 players) Q:diamond: 7:diamond: T:spade:
SB checks, Hero bets $0.32, fold

Hero wins $0.53


Cake - $0.04 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: $4.03
Hero (BTN): $7.70
SB: $3.91
BB: $1.43
UTG: $4.65
UTG+1: $13.53
MP: $3.07
MP+1: $5.54
LP: $3.96

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: ($0.06) Hero has 9:heart: 7:heart:

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, CO calls $0.04, Hero raises to $0.18, fold, fold, CO calls $0.14

Flop: ($0.42, 2 players) J:spade: A:diamond: K:diamond:
CO checks, Hero bets $0.25, fold

Hero wins $0.40

F4STFORW4RD said:

I tend to think of KT as a marginal hand...

Click to expand...

It's a marginal hand to take to the flop multiway because you are almost never (except in this case) going to flop something you will be really happy about. It's plenty good enough to punish limpers and isolate against a single player who will c/f 70% of the time.

also in this case since villains' ranges tend to be combo-ey (pair + SD a lot) you'd do well to get the money in with cards to come.

WVHillbilly said:

It is in absolute value but who cares you're on the button with a few limpers. Your cards are almost irrelevant these people want to give you their money, make sure you get the max from them.

Here are a couple of hands I played last night at Cake (4nl):
Cake - $0.04 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BB: $3.72
UTG: $10.58
UTG+1: $4.65
MP: $1.42
MP+1: $3.94
LP: $4.82
CO: $4.00
Hero (BTN): $4.41
SB: $2.58

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04, CO posts DB $0.04

Pre Flop: ($0.10) Hero has 8♠ K♣

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 calls $0.04, fold, CO checks, Hero raises to $0.22, SB calls $0.20, fold, fold, fold

Flop: ($0.56, 2 players) Q♦ 7♦ T♠
SB checks, Hero bets $0.32, fold

Hero wins $0.53


Cake - $0.04 NL - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: $4.03
Hero (BTN): $7.70
SB: $3.91
BB: $1.43
UTG: $4.65
UTG+1: $13.53
MP: $3.07
MP+1: $5.54
LP: $3.96

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: ($0.06) Hero has 9♥ 7♥

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, CO calls $0.04, Hero raises to $0.18, fold, fold, CO calls $0.14

Flop: ($0.42, 2 players) J♠ A♦ K♦
CO checks, Hero bets $0.25, fold

Hero wins $0.40

Click to expand...

aggro-tard FR players!

^what they said.

Stop playing with scared money. If you feel you don't have a big enough BR either:

1) Add more money
2) Scale back the amount of tables you play
3) Do both

baudib1 said:

aggro-tard FR players!

Click to expand...

Hey I resemble that remark!

whats your name on cake WV?

and OP, try and use the good advise here...
I question it sometimes, ignore it sometimes, heck
dont know if its even made my game better (still short term)
but in the long run Im sure my game has/will improve from
the great wisdom here

gl out there

WVUHillbilly

Get your value ( by that make them PAY!!!! )

OK thanks guys

Anyway, I still didn't shove!

Poker Stars - $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em (7 players) Poker Stars Hand Converter Tool from CardsChat.com


SB: $1.08
BB: $1.43
UTG: $5.35
MP: $2.26
MP+1: $0.83
CO: $0.90
BTN Hero: $2.42
realUAplayer - Sitting Out


Pre-flop: ($0.03) Hero is BTN and dealt
UTG folds, MP calls $0.02, MP+1 calls $0.02, CO folds, Hero calls $0.02, SB folds, BB checks


Flop: ($0.09) (4 players)
BB bets $0.02, MP folds, MP+1 raises to $0.04, Hero raises to $0.10, BB raises to $0.16, MP+1 calls $0.12, Hero raises to $0.50, BB calls $0.34, MP+1 calls $0.34


Turn: ($1.59) (3 players)
BB checks, MP+1 checks, Hero bets $0.76, BB calls $0.76, MP+1 calls $0.31 (All-in)


River: ($3.42) (3 players)
BB checks

Are you still seriously asking what you should do? Guy has less than 20c left in a 3.50 pot? Bet the rest of it and hope he calls.