$2 NLHE Full Ring: Day 14 Hand Analysis

Aggression 1

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to RVladimiro [9s][9c]
EP: raises $0.06 to $0.08 (5/5/?)
RVladimiro: calls $0.08
CO: calls $0.08 (28/11/?)
BU: calls $0.08 (38/0/2)

*** FLOP *** [4c][3d][Qs]
One scare card to me. I bet to know where I was, to look for folds and to negate position and take care of the betting. I usually look for 1/2 pot bets. In this case with the scare card I decided to bet around 1/3.
EP: checks
RVladimiro: bets $0.10
CO: folds
BU: calls $0.10
EP: folds

*** TURN *** [4c][3d][Qs][Jc]
Another scare card. Now I wanted to know where he was. He wasn't sure.
RVladimiro: checks
BU: checks

*** RIVER *** [4c][3d][Qs][Jc][As]
Another scare card. Worst case scenario was that he had the ace, but he played so many hands he could have anything. So, backed up by my 99s I decided to bet 1/2 the pot mostly because I wanted to negate position and put pressure. It was a immediate fold.
RVladimiro: bets $0.26
BU: folds
Uncalled bet ($0.26) returned to RVladimiro
RVladimiro collected $0.53 from pot

Question: When I don't know exactly where I am, I bet the flop and check the turn. My main concern is that I'm giving a free card. In this case, there was a straight draw. Considering I had a pair (even if not the highest), would it be fair to bet the river and turn higher?

I think at this level most players have no idea of what pot odds are and they'll just call and the best I can do is maintain aggression when I feel I'm in front.

RVladimiro said:

Aggression 1

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to RVladimiro 9♠9♣
EP: raises $0.06 to $0.08 (5/5/?)
RVladimiro: calls $0.08
CO: calls $0.08 (28/11/?)
BU: calls $0.08 (38/0/2)

*** FLOP *** 4♣3♦Q♠
One scare card to me. I bet to know where I was, to look for folds and to negate position and take care of the betting. I usually look for 1/2 pot bets. In this case with the scare card I decided to bet around 1/3.
EP: checks
RVladimiro: bets $0.10
CO: folds
BU: calls $0.10
EP: folds

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I think you would do well to read this thread https://www.cardschat.com/forum/cash-games-11/why-you-betting-189182/. It explains pretty clearly all the reasons we should be betting. Betting to find out where you are isnt one of them and can cost you a lot of money in the long run.

If you are betting here I think it would be for value although vs 3 opponents I could see a reason to check here. When betting for value we want calls from worse hands, not folds. In this case it could be any pp less then 99 and overcards. If we bet 2/3 - 3/4 pot were are giving them incorrect odds to draw to their overs or their 2 outs in the case of smaller pp's.

You need to read that article ^

Dont bet to find where you are, and dont bet 1/3rd of the pot ever really, this allows people to play perfectly against you, and it just screams "i have a hand i like a bit but not a lot but want to see if you have the Q"

This is also a spot where i dont think betting is good at all, you arent in position as theres two guys to your left, i think its a check fold usually although it depends on who bets, but playing multiway always sucks and even more so when out of position.

Betting to find out where you are doesnt work here because even if you get called he could have a pocket pair that you beat, a pair that you beat, or he could have a Q, and any amount of drawing hands as you're not stopping anyone drawing with small bets.

Post a few more hands, theres not much to say about this one, you were right in calling, you missed a 9, you are multi way , best not to bet here.

Also betting the river there is awful with 9's i think, i mean nothing worse is going to call you so just check

Thanks acky100 and brank. I read the article and it makes perfect sense. I have one doubt though. Was my bet wrong because it was on a multiway pot? Would it be correct on a heads up pot considering the chance of the other guy not hitting the flop?

You're welcome, things will start to make more sense.

Heres how i see it (if we're heads up and not multiway) if you had AK here it would be a good flop to c-bet if we are checked too in position. If we have AK and we're out of position a c-bet would probably be fine also, as the board isnt too scary and lots of opponents are going to fold quite happily if they dont have a Q.

But.. we have 99 and we're out of position. Lets imagine we're heads up but out of position: So we have 99 which has some showdown value as we've made a pair, we're most likely ahead but betting isnt going to find out where we are as they either fold and we dont get value for our most likely best hand, or they call and we're faced with a tricky situation on the turn as we still dont know if they have the Q. I like checking here and if they bet like half the pot i like calling, cause then they will have to think twice before betting again if they dont have the Q, if they do bet again i fold my 9's as theyre most likely ahead. Lots of times though they will realise there bet didnt work and just check to the end where our 9's hold up.

Try reading some articles about c-betting, you'll learn which flops are good to c-bet on and which ones are bad. But in general you really shouldnt be c-betting with this many players in a hand especially out of position.

acky100 said:

This is also a spot where i dont think betting is good at all, you arent in position as theres two guys to your left, i think its a check fold usually although it depends on who bets, but playing multiway always sucks and even more so when out of position.

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wat.

This flop is really dry and is perfect to cbet and these two guys are BAD. Here's why we should bet imo:

1) It's 2nl. 2nl players love to play fit or fold so you can pretty much cbet ANY flop and expect folds most of the time

2) By betting the flop we can get value from these guys if they like to call flop cbets a lot with their smaller pairs or draws, this also gives us the opportunity to collect dead money from hands like KJ/AJ etc and sets us up to fold out TT(if one has it) if another broadway card rolls out on the turn and we barrel.

So ya, I like cbetting.

^^^^ Logic is sound except Hero cant cbet a flop where he wasnt the PFR.

its multiway and and 2nl players dont fold dont see the point in betting there myself :s

**** didn't read it right. Still like betting though especially if "people don't fold" at 2nl because then I'm purely vbetting.

that could be true until an over card comes and then we'd be a bit more confused about where we stood, sure its marginal but just trying to keep the guy out of marginal spots for now

It's not marginal. It's a great spot to bet imo.