$2 NLHE 6-max: ZOOM Multiway game with QTs

alipalip

alipalip

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Hello!
I usualy don`t call 3-bets OOP with SC but in this cause there was a fishy face on BTN(I know that 4 hand sample is nothing, but he was short stack,and one tabling)so I aspect that he
will call to so if I hit the board the BTN will pay out.
Was that the right move? And what about the flop?

PokerStars - $0.02 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $1.93 (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, hands: 4)
SB: $2.00 (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
Hero (BB): $2.03
UTG: $2.00 (VPIP: 15.24, PFR: 9.52, 3Bet Preflop: 2.35, Hands: 215)
MP: $5.40 (VPIP: 22.64, PFR: 22.64, 3Bet Preflop: 13.33, Hands: 53)
CO: $1.95

SB posts SB $0.01, Hero posts BB $0.02

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.03) Hero has T:diamond: Q:diamond:

fold, fold, CO raises to $0.06, BTN calls $0.06, SB raises to $0.20, Hero calls $0.18, fold, BTN calls $0.14

Flop: ($0.66, 3 players) J:diamond: A:spade: 8:diamond:
SB bets $0.38, Hero raises to $1.08, BTN raises to $1.73 and is all-in, SB raises to $1.80 and is all-in, Hero calls $0.72

Turn: ($5.99, 3 players) 9:heart:

River: ($5.99, 3 players) 4:heart:

SB shows A:heart: K:heart: (One Pair, Aces)

Main Pot [$5.85]: (Pre 45%, Flop 8%, Turn 0%)
Side Pot#1 [$0.14]: (Pre 63%, Flop 46%, Turn 0%)

Hero shows T:diamond: Q:diamond: (Straight, Queen High)

Main Pot [$5.85]: (Pre 29%, Flop 49%, Turn 90%)
Side Pot#1 [$0.14]: (Pre 37%, Flop 54%, Turn 100%)

BTN shows 8:club: J:club: (Two Pair, Jacks and Eights)

Main Pot [$5.85]: (Pre 26%, Flop 44%, Turn 10%)

Hero wins $5.78
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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Nah not spew... If your noticed BTN calls capping his range behind CO...

We have 2 source of income... so well played but if you didn't notice the BTN flat to CO then it is spew :)
 
IPlay

IPlay

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Nah not spew... If your noticed BTN calls capping his range behind CO...

We have 2 source of income... so well played but if you didn't notice the BTN flat to CO then it is spew :)

QTs in a 3 bet pot is just not good unless there is a literal deep stacked whale you can stack but we are only 100bb effective against meh players. The only way we are getting it in post a favorite is if we flop trip Ts or Qs and even then we might be behind. What happened here is basically a best case scenario for us and we got very lucky to win this hand.

This hand is pure gamble gamble.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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yeah and the original raiser could 4bet... then we just burnt money for nothing.

i cant help notice ak loses again on an aj board haha
 
IPlay

IPlay

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yeah and the original raiser could 4bet... then we just burnt money for nothing.

i cant help notice ak loses again on an aj board haha

Lol think about these spots this way. If this hand wasn't suited would I EVER call? If the answer is no, fold it, if the answer is maybe then calling can't be too bad. This isn't an exact science or anything but it helps me from making too many calling mistakes with suited junk.
 
Romario2223

Romario2223

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Yep fold pre this hand
 
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seventhsense

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Fold pre. The original raiser can 4 bet and then we just burned money. There will be better spots to get involved with fish.

He isn't a whale from any evidence you have seen and everyone at 2nl is a fish. Not a good enough reason to get involved. We all do it from time to time.. We use bad excuses to play pretty cards.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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yeah but isnt the days game all about going wider.... i mean theres so many tags out there... a lag cant be a bad solution
 
IPlay

IPlay

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yeah but isnt the days game all about going wider.... i mean theres so many tags out there... a lag cant be a bad solution

Cold calling 3 bets with Q10s is not something a good lag would do.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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but we have relative position except on cut off.. its not that bad

so if the puzzle to this hand was cutoff folds 80+% to 3bets its not bad cuz... buttons capped so if we hit our queen its not bad... but we have position on the danger man incase he goes crazy.

so we play queen against button and draws against sb
 
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seventhsense

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seventhsense

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It is very advisable that new players/learning players play a fairly tight game (anyone below 100nl). They will be more profitable because post-flop is straight forward more frequently until they learn how to play post flop.

Yes, you see the most profitable pros aren't nits, but these players have likely put millions of hands into their game. They are better than you. When you get that good, you can LAG.
 
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nicolas jesus

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hi

Not good the call pre flop. Apart is zoom which is even worse call pre flop. Your play has zero balance.
Post flop guess this well played, but maybe better flat call the flop, in theory never do fold an ace. Have a lot of equity but in theory you're behind. In addition to cold call pre flop you should have got a compound range, otherwise your rank is very transparent. Post flop raise and stackearte You can do the flop, but it seems good to balance line to call the flop because in principle you go behind
 
Vini_lepoker

Vini_lepoker

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I would be more inclined to fold, we don't have position and if you call, you don't have initiative. You just happened to get a nice flop.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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yeh but we are likely to get paid off at these levels just sayin

so the whole win small lose big isnt exactly correct
 
IPlay

IPlay

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yeh but we are likely to get paid off at these levels just sayin

so the whole win small lose big isnt exactly correct

Look at what happened though. We got a damn near nutted flop for our hand and still only got it in as a coin flip.

You are a very optimistic player Aces.
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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Look at what happened though. We got a damn near nutted flop for our hand and still only got it in as a coin flip.

You are a very optimistic player Aces.

have to have some gamble... full bluff or full value is never enough
 
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seventhsense

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yeh but we are likely to get paid off at these levels just sayin

so the whole win small lose big isnt exactly correct

You narrow your winrate when you open up too much. Did you read the link?
 
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kozong

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i dont like the preflop call.
but the flop 3b is well played, because we dont want to lose value if any scare cards show up on later streets.
 
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ChrisMurray

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Pre-flop: This isn't even a close pot. I'm snap-folding this as soon as the 3-bet comes in. The reasoning is we're OOP against 2 of the 3 players, we're not last to act (the CO could easily 4-bet), we don't have any reads on the players, we're usually dominated by at least one player, if we flop a draw, it's rarely going to be to the nuts (a consideration in a 4-way pot), we only have $0.02 committed (so we're not priced in at all). That's 'Why not to play in 6 short reasons'. It's true that the CO looks fishy, but we don't know what type of fish. He could very easily be a passive fish that only 3-bet big hands in which case this nugget of information makes this an even worse call. I think the lesson here is that you need a combination of factors in your favour to unorthodox plays, not just one. You've got to weigh up the pro's and con's of the situation.
As played, the SB is probably going to be squeezing quite wide, so we'll give him a range of 88+, AKo, A2s+ and KQs. Since he's squeezing two players in LP, he's going to have a wider range than a standard squeeze, with more bluffs in. Anyhow, this is probably as wide as he possibly goes here.
The BTN calls and since he's IP and getting a good price (from your call) he's probably calling most of his range. Since I wouldn't expect his calling range to be too wide from the COs initial raise (he 3-bets quite a lot I think), we have to adjust his range to include only hands that both call the initial raise from the CO, and call a squeeze from the SB. I put this together: 77-JJ, AQo, ATs-AQs, KTs, QJs, JTs, 65s.


Flop: This is a pretty great flop for us. A strong flush draw, a double gutshot and a straight flush gutshot. We should know instantly that we have at least 15 outs, possibly more if we're not against an A (although we often are). This gives us about a 54% chance to hit a diamond, K or 9 by the river. Since we're a favourite to just about any hand, we should play this fast and look to semi-bluff here.
The SB c-bets into 2 players. That's pretty strong and means he has a minimum of Ax here. That's the majority of his range but he can also have sets (88,JJ and AA), AJ. Raising is good here, but I just shove to get maximum fold equity (winning this without any risk is better than flipping for stacks if we can). The BTN shipping it behind you is super-strong, but it also gives you way better odds on your draw, so it's a good thing for you. The action behind him is so strong, I'd expect him to have either AJ, 88 or JJ every time here.
Once the SB moves all-in we can take weak aces out of his range, he's probably got a minimum of AK here (and often he'll have better). Obviously we call.

Now, obviously we hit our hand, which was nice and we nearly treble up. We should note that both players overvalued weak hands. The BTN really should have folded J8 with the action behind him, and I would sure as hell have folded AK with two players effectively going all-in behind me if I were the squeezer.

Post-flop this hand plays itself, pre-flop we simply need to fold.
 
Figaroo2

Figaroo2

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This is just a shocking call preflop.
No need to go into any more detail.
 
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