$2 NLHE 6-max: Quite passive line 3bet pot OOP TPBK

B

braveslice

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Did my play make any sense? River decision? Turn bet surely is standard?

Villain Notes: Barrel 2ndP
WWSF: 5/15, WTS 2/15, W$SD 0/2, FCB 4/5, Foldto3bet 2/5, AFqriver 2/2, AFq 10/20, RFI button 4/10

I did read him not that aggressive for 6max who doesn’t know how to play river and might call 3bets quite wide.

Hero: Is seen somewhat over tight tag, with occasional overplays (standard for the level).


PokerStars - $0.02 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 124.5 BB (VPIP: 22.22, PFR: 17.59, 3Bet Preflop: 14.29, hands: 111)
SB: 112 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 3)
Hero (BB): 142.5 BB
UTG: 102 BB (VPIP: 23.53, PFR: 17.65, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 19)
MP: 81.5 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 17.65, 3Bet Preflop: 7.41, Hands: 68)
CO: 128 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K T

fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 3 BB, fold, Hero raises to 9.5 BB, BTN calls 6.5 BB

Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 5 2 K
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: (19.5 BB, 2 players) 4
Hero bets 9.5 BB, BTN calls 9.5 BB

River: (38.5 BB, 2 players) 2
Hero checks, BTN bets 22 BB, Hero Is thinking this might be fold, but calling probably is not too wrong.
 
t1riel

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Why check the flop? You decided to get aggressive with a marginal hand and you hit top pair. Bet the flop.
 
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braveslice

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Why check the flop? You decided to get aggressive with a marginal hand and you hit top pair. Bet the flop.

I went for default two street for value line, given 3bet pot, bad kicker and dry flop, but still good enough hand to defend vs agression at least a bit. So I figured keeping his range a bit wider on the flop might be more profitable and taking that value later if possible and same time aiming to keep pot small.

Given run out I felt second barrel is useless. It might be that 2 street value would be better, even though I don't see what worse hands would call. My last hand question was similar and the answer was 2 streets, but I figured this might be just enough different to warrant one street.
 
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c9h13no3

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This guy is slightly tight in steal position (40%) and doesn't fold to 3bets. Your preflop play seems bad, just fold this.

I'd cbet that flop and check turn. I think his range narrows more the way you played it. You can't really play WA/WB OOP.


Call the river.
 
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As played, I'd say call the river
 
nucl

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I like your check on the flop.
You have top pair with weak kicker so you don't want to inflate the pot, and you keep his airs in.
I just don't understand your check on the river. Are you turning your hand into a bluff catcher?
If yes then call.
If no the call again.
With villain checking back the flop seems to me that he might have some 66/TT in his range, since JJ+ will 4bet pre.
So you have to go for value on the river.
 
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braveslice

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This guy is slightly tight in steal position (40%) and doesn't fold to 3bets. Your preflop play seems bad, just fold this.
Yes.
I'd cbet that flop and check turn. I think his range narrows more the way you played it. You can't really play WA/WB OOP.
Call the river.
=) I actually did remember this from last time you commented and had even couple of sentenced about narrowing range in my opening post when no CB. I did delete those lines because my writing was not clear and the idea was lost. And this has been part of my thinking process (fuzzy way but still) when I decide to CB or when someone do not CB. The greatest EV value for me has been confidence to value bet more defined range against checks, especially noCB/Call. At my level this is however considered very advanced concept and is mostly not implemented to thought process at all by most villains and me only partly, so using it against them is not always correct as an aggressor imo.
I never understood that ‘You can't really play WA/WB OOP’, I do remember there was big discussion about it couple of months back, the reason might be that against many best value line is to check given mandatory aggression demands, because many players here know that to be a winning player you need to always bet, like always.
As played, I'd say call the river
Thx, yes did that. I guess there really is no other choice after checking the river.
Are you turning your hand into a bluff catcher?
Not really bluff catcher. If he bets worse then good, but the reason I posted this hand was mainly because I don’t know what to think on the river. Would he really call 66+ pair? What hand he beats from me? At worst I have TT+. If he calls wide, his range still contains KJ,KQ and AK (not that many AK anymore). If he really is willing to call 66+ then yes, the answer seems to the same than last time I asked TPBK -> 2 streets, while second barrel needs to be reasonable small.
With villain checking back the flop seems to me that he might have some 66/TT in his range, since JJ+ will 4bet pre.
So you have to go for value on the river.
This was new way of thinking to me, so the same concept c9h13no3 said about narrowing range when not Cbetting can be used here too.
 
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braveslice

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Interesting I just said to c9h13no3 that nobody is really using ‘not betting narrows ranges’ and then I assume villain puts me to TT+ Contradiction?
 
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It seems the whole hand is a contradiction because hero changes plans on the river.

Well is out of plan, because he forgot why he check on the flop. Reason to check flop is to assume villain uses it as an excuse to call wider so x-b-b as a base line is only logical one.

I think I change to b-x-b line; this line gives me headache. :marchmell


He had 88.

Thx!


 
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Figaroo2

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Not sure what you are confused about tbh. You played it ok. On the river here I bet versus passive players and check and bluff catch versus the aggressive types.When you check twice post flop you are opening a big bluffing window on the river you should be calling in these spots nearly always.
 
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braveslice

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Well, I would be really surprised if you would be confused on a basic case like this ;D I was actually thinking b-x-x/c line, that should work too against too agressive?

QJT and maybe 9 would have made this standard case for me too, also A, either flop, turn or river. However the reason why it's standard was lost to me.
 
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John A

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Call preflop. Flop check on this board is fine. Betting is fine also.

Turn is fine, but I might bet ~11. River, in a 3-bet pot here against someone who looks like he might be aggressive I like a check/call. I like a PS bet or even slight over bet better though.
 
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braveslice

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Thx John there is always the next level, sigh.
Call preflop.
I have been lazy, and delayed making transformation to more theoretically correct ranges mostly because results are good enough, but well still in 2NL I should be more determined to learn new ways. Thx for pointing this out.

My strategy for now is to 3bet hands that are possible to call ‘somewhat easy’ mostly to side step the struggle of actually playing them.

For example against 40% range I think I should call K9o too, but K9o is just way too difficult hand to play, so if I 3bet and get called I’m totally lost, KTo if I 3bet I have smallish idea how to play it. I kind of get that having T,9,8 as a kicker has not too much difference, but still enough for confidence.

Also given huge rake, should I kind of play tighter range than advised and also 3bet more?

Call preflop. Flop check on this board is fine. Betting is fine also.

Turn is fine, but I might bet ~11. River, in a 3-bet pot here against someone who looks like he might be aggressive I like a check/call. I like a PS bet or even slight over bet better though.
I think I understand ~11 OTT and that should be easy to implement, but honestly I have no clue how to understand ‘I like a PS bet or even slight over bet better though’ Am I repping AT,AQ? Or am I just doing because of the level and mistakes?
 
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braveslice

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River, in a 3-bet pot here against someone who looks like he might be aggressive I like a check/call. I like a PS bet or even slight over bet better though.

Like anyone has a suggestion or guess why John would suggest large bet on the river? Theories welcome, no facts needed.
 
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