$2 NLHE 6-max: flopped set on 3 heart flop vs fishy

micromachine

micromachine

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Villain is 48/9 (!) over 56 hands.

My question is whether calling, raising or shoving is the best action.

pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB ($2.40)
Hero (UTG) ($2.71)
MP ($2.50)
Button ($1.51)
SB ($0.79)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J
spade.gif
, J
diamond.gif

Hero bets $0.08, 3 folds, BB calls $0.06

Flop: ($0.17) J
heart.gif
, 6
heart.gif
, K
heart.gif
(2 players)
BB bets $0.20

Hero ??
 
N

NoOneYouKnow

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If this is a loose passive player it is a snap fold. Leading pot is ultra strength for these villains. If it is an aggro maniac I would prefer c/c flop c/jam turn if you fade the 4th heart. Gets you 2 extra Kx bets.
 
Cafeman

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It's not a snap fold. Call and boat up, or raise and get it in. You've got middle set yo!
 
Pascal-lf

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If this is a loose passive player it is a snap fold. Leading pot is ultra strength for these villains. If it is an aggro maniac I would prefer c/c flop c/jam turn if you fade the 4th heart. Gets you 2 extra Kx bets.

an aggro maniac doesnt fold Kx on this board
 
micromachine

micromachine

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It's not a snap fold. Call and boat up, or raise and get it in. You've got middle set yo!

Well I certainly didn't fold this :)

I'm wondering whether calling the flop and (likely) turn bets and hoping to dodge a heart or boat up is better than shoving it all in and hoping to be called by Ah containing hands, 66 and maybe AK?
 
Cafeman

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Yeah sure, I was responding to the other post about that.

I can see someone betting big not wanting you to draw cheaply with a FD yourself. So, really, I'm for not f'ing about on the flop. And we don't really care about having no FE since his range for doing this isn't only made flushes. In fact, surely a made flush from a loose passive would often c/r or c/c? Nah, get it in and feel good about it imo.
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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Yeah but he's loose passive, at 2nl he could have absolutely ANYTHING.

Personally I raise to see where I am, your ahead of a lot of his range and him having flopped a flush is extremely unlikely.. make him pay to draw!
 
ChuckTs

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Personally I raise to see where I am

ಠ_ಠ

Raise for value, don't fold. We can't fold once we raise, but most of our value is going to come from the hands he bet/calls the flop with - weak combo draws, straight draws, Kx, flush draws, random 9h9x type hands etc. Get value before he either outdraws you or an action killer comes.
 
S

Sori

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His range is clearly much more than a flopped flush. I think you are ahead here, as he probably doesn't want you to fold if he did flop a flush and may bet smaller or c/r. Your odds of boating and beating a flush make this a position where I will never fold here with this type of opp. I like a raise in this situation, probably just shove it actually.
 
bgomez89

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If this is a loose passive player it is a snap fold. Leading pot is ultra strength for these villains. If it is an aggro maniac I would prefer c/c flop c/jam turn if you fade the 4th heart. Gets you 2 extra Kx bets.

Nope.

Let's raise the flop please to get value from Kx, 66, Ahx
 
D

DEdwardsNJ

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Raise for value, don't fold. We can't fold once we raise, but most of our value is going to come from the hands he bet/calls the flop with - weak combo draws, straight draws, Kx, flush draws, random 9h9x type hands etc. Get value before he either outdraws you or an action killer comes.
Great post. People should read this over and over again until they understand why it's the correct thing to do...
 
complex1

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i would check it to see if he hits something and even if he dont i might check thr turn to try anfd induce a bet.
 
TylerN

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i would check it to see if he hits something and even if he dont i might check thr turn to try anfd induce a bet.

did u not read any of the posts in here?
 
blueskies

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Looks like a K. A fish doesnt overbet the pot if he has a made flush. At least I haven't seen one that does.
 
OMGITSOVER9K

OMGITSOVER9K

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Mistyped what I meant to say, sorry haha. I mean we're ahead of everything but a flopped flush and KK, and he is loose-passive but surely he 3 bets KK pre.

So assuming that, we're ahead here and raise to see if he wants to go with the hand or not. Hopefully that's a better description of what I meant.
 
micromachine

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Here's how it played out:

I shoved and he called with AhKc and hit Th on the turn for the nut flush.

Looking back at the hand I was 69% favorite on the flop so the shove was fine. I'm still not sure whether raising would have been better or not though! Probably not much difference...
 
Cafeman

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I think with more experience you will learn to resuckout on the river :D
 
R

RamdeeBen

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Calling is the worse, I think just shoving is the best as he is always going to call any pair and any flush draw.
 
Nathan Williams

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$1.20. Shove any turn.
 
Nathan Williams

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If this is a loose passive player it is a snap fold. Leading pot is ultra strength for these villains.

This is 100% wrong. When they bet strong like this, especially when it is a slight overbet it is never with the nuts. It is usually with a top pair type hand with no kicker. Maybe the naked Ah. Something ok to decent but not great.
 
rssurfer54

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If this is a loose passive player it is a snap fold. Leading pot is ultra strength for these villains. If it is an aggro maniac I would prefer c/c flop c/jam turn if you fade the 4th heart. Gets you 2 extra Kx bets.

This has to be a troll.
 
blueskies

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Here's how it played out:

I shoved and he called with AhKc and hit Th on the turn for the nut flush.

Looking back at the hand I was 69% favorite on the flop so the shove was fine. I'm still not sure whether raising would have been better or not though! Probably not much difference...

Nothing to regret here. He wasn't folding his hand no matter what. And putting him on a K is correct. With a bet like that, it's almost never a made flush.

I would overbet the pot if I had something like a 5 high flush, but I haven't shown down a hand against anyone else who did that.
 
blueskies

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I had the same situation. Except it was a set of 5s on an all spade board and I got check raised.

It felt like I was probably behind but I just couldn't bring myself to fold it and all he had was around $1.40 so I went all in. He did flop a flush but the board paired on the river and I won.

It's always better to be lucky than good.
 
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