$2 NLHE 6-max: Bet half pot when the flush comes on the river?

Cafeman

Cafeman

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Total posts
3,200
Chips
0
poker stars $2.00 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 1193877
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

MP: $1.81
CO: $2.99
BTN: $2.20
SB: $2.00
Hero (BB): $2.00
UTG: $5.09

Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero is BB with Q
diamond.gif
4
heart.gif

1 fold, MP calls $0.02, 3 folds, Hero checks

Flop: ($0.05) Q
spade.gif
3
club.gif
8
spade.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $0.03, MP calls $0.03

Turn: ($0.11) 4
diamond.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $0.08, MP calls $0.08

River: ($0.27) 6
spade.gif
(2 players)
Hero ???

No stats on villain. He limped in, so I don't have him on a set, so apart from 2 spades, I have him beat. When the flush comes on the river, should I check or bet out? I figure if I bet out just about half pot or whatever, he /might/ call with worse, but the point is, he sure as hell is going to raise if he has the flush and then I know where I stand. If I check the river then he can assume I don't have the flush and bet, and if that happens I'm really in a tight spot. So, should I bet out smallish on the river?
 
Cafeman

Cafeman

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Total posts
3,200
Chips
0
I suppose I had him on a queen when he called me. Of course 57 is possible I suppose? Hanging in there for a gutshot seems a bit spewy though...
 
C

ComplexPlaya

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Total posts
1,347
Chips
0
Why would you say he can't have a set? limp/calling pocket pairs is pretty standard for bad players.

Anyway, bet bigger on all streats, bet like $0.20 on river. Don't "put him on" a queen or a set or a flush etc. he can have any of those, but you're beating his calling range so just bet/fold it.
 
bgomez89

bgomez89

Resident Thugmaster
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 3, 2009
Total posts
3,127
Chips
0
why are we betting the river when all draws hit and we have TP with a shitty kicker?
 
Cafeman

Cafeman

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Total posts
3,200
Chips
0
Why would you say he can't have a set? limp/calling pocket pairs is pretty standard for bad players.
I didn't say he can't have a set, I just didn't think he would based on his betting. Of course he could.

Anyway, bet bigger on all streats, bet like $0.20 on river. Don't "put him on" a queen or a set or a flush etc. he can have any of those, but you're beating his calling range so just bet/fold it.
Righto, thanks.

why are we betting the river when all draws hit and we have TP with a shitty kicker?
I had two pair by the turn. When you say all draws hit, I can only really see one hitting and that's the flush, which other draws are hitting? Also, at 2nl, people call down top pair all the time, so me having two pair is not insignificant at this level imo.
 
Cafeman

Cafeman

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Total posts
3,200
Chips
0
Don't "put him on" a queen or a set or a flush etc. he can have any of those, but you're beating his calling range so just bet/fold it.
So to be clear, I would be bet/folding on the river for value because my hand isn't bad and there's a chance he calls with worse, and if he raises then we figure I'm beat (he has a set/straight/flush) and we fold.
 
C

ComplexPlaya

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Total posts
1,347
Chips
0
So to be clear, I would be bet/folding on the river for value because my hand isn't bad and there's a chance he calls with worse, and if he raises then we figure I'm beat (he has a set/straight/flush) and we fold.

Yeah, if you think most of the stuff that calls a river bet is behind then you make money by betting. In this case there is a higher % of combos of Qx, lesser 2 pairs etc. than higher 2 pairs, sets, flush.

As for folding if he raises - depends on the raise size, if he shoves you're probably not getting the odds to call (don't want to do the math now, you can try it yourself). If he doesn't raise too big though and you get something like 4:1 pot odds which means you have to be good 20% of the time or more then you can call. Against a normal raise size it's a fold tho.
 
Cafeman

Cafeman

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 12, 2011
Total posts
3,200
Chips
0
Thanks a lot for your input CP.

In the end, I checked, and as soon as I did it I thought, damn, but fortunately he didn't go nuts and shove, he just checked and showed a pair of 8s.
 
bgomez89

bgomez89

Resident Thugmaster
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 3, 2009
Total posts
3,127
Chips
0
I had two pair by the turn. When you say all draws hit, I can only really see one hitting and that's the flush, which other draws are hitting? Also, at 2nl, people call down top pair all the time, so me having two pair is not insignificant at this level imo.
Good catch, im not used to hitting two pair with Q4o obv lol. Other draws that hit are the unlikely straight like 57 and other two pairs. Yes, I agree he's calling down with TP too, hence why i would've rather just check/folded river before i knew we had two pair.

Yeah, if you think most of the stuff that calls a river bet is behind then you make money by betting. In this case there is a higher % of combos of Qx, lesser 2 pairs etc. than higher 2 pairs, sets, flush.

As for folding if he raises - depends on the raise size, if he shoves you're probably not getting the odds to call (don't want to do the math now, you can try it yourself). If he doesn't raise too big though and you get something like 4:1 pot odds which means you have to be good 20% of the time or more then you can call. Against a normal raise size it's a fold tho.
and this
 
Full Flush Poker
Top