$2 NLHE 6-max: b/f, b/c, x/f, x/c river what is best?

BluffMeAllIn

BluffMeAllIn

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PokerStars - $0.02 Ante $0.01 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 289.5 BB
BB: 56.5 BB (VPIP: 43.42, PFR: 17.11, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, hands: 77)
UTG: 112 BB (VPIP: 54.55, PFR: 9.09, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
MP: 190 BB (VPIP: 26.79, PFR: 21.43, 3Bet Preflop: 13.64, Hands: 58)
CO: 380 BB (VPIP: 40.70, PFR: 15.70, 3Bet Preflop: 7.14, Hands: 176)
BTN: 250 BB (VPIP: 27.82, PFR: 15.60, 3Bet Preflop: 5.77, Hands: 2,217)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, 6 players post ante of 0.5 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 4.5 BB) Hero has K:diamond: T:spade:

UTG calls 1 BB, fold, fold, BTN calls 1 BB, Hero calls 0.5 BB, BB checks

Flop: (7 BB, 4 players) 5:club: 9:spade: 8:diamond:
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks, BTN checks

Turn: (7 BB, 4 players) J:club:
Hero bets 5 BB, fold, UTG calls 5 BB, fold

River: (17 BB, 2 players) 7:club:
???????
 
akaRobbo

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What's the problem? Value bet river
 
Theromeo2k

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Pre is fine, flop is fine, turn is fine soooo... Yeah, value bet.
 
Delvuter

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This is a scenario I am really interested in. I am always on a draw and trying to find the best way is crucial, find it and all is golden, don't and spew spew spew. I always call in SB too, so I think that is right. I won't even bet this hand generally in any other position unless the cards have cooled off and I need to play something to keep my VPIP/PFR above 25%. Ok, so, if I don't bet on preflop I will always usually probe bet on the flop especially out of position to see where I am at. Often I get the pot right there or at least get it down to just one other caller. Then on the turn do I want to check or bet, I think check and see what the other guy is thinking. If he checks YAY, if he bets let's see what odds he gave us, if they are good we call. Or now and again we want to 3-bet and this might be a good spot because a check-raise looks strong. If he calls our 3-bet YAY, if he re-raises we fold. Then the river, I bet here if I did as matter of fact check-raise the turn because w/his stats he has nothing at least 50% of the time. I know we don't have a lot of hands on this guy as for as stats goes, but he has already played more than 50% of his hands in just 11 hands dealt. In just 11 hands he has a few PFR, but not this hand. I bet the river here too even if I had just bet the turn and he called because we are repping we got our straight even if we didn't. Only thing we are afraid of is something like A6 or 6's.

...oh if he gives us good odds on a re-raise on the turn had we check-raised we call that, if he shoves or something crazy we fold.
 
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duggs

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I'm isolating pre myself, bloat the pot against a 60% range that is capped? sounds good to me, as played vbet
 
Delvuter

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Iso w/KTo OOP? Guessing you play w/a wide range of hands too so your image is loose so you'll get called a lot by multiple and very rarely isolate.
 
duggs

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isolating KTo hardly makes me loose.
 
Delvuter

Delvuter

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Well sure, if that move is a way to randomize your play, but it sounds like it is something you would regularly bet w/and that hand is wide. KTo has a ton of issues, especially OOP. Odds are based off what I now know from this one hand that you are fairly loose. Are you?

...nothing wrong w/being loose.
 
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Aces2w1n

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Bet pre.

cbet flop

double barrel turn

jam river.


You'd be amazed what your villains pickup along the way... bad players who slow play 2 pair ... sets whatever.

Even trash hands or medium/low pair even call at times if they are bad enough. But just make sure you get your money in with your bigger hands or your hurting your winrate.

Also if a villain does end up flushing even after playing the line we took, we will do so much better in the longterm... Just make sure you put a note on these guys that they chase draws on the turn, it's where a lot of money comes from :)

Soon as you doubt value betting and skip a street is the moment u start losing at this level.
 
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duggs

duggs

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Well sure, if that move is a way to randomize your play, but it sounds like it is something you would regularly bet w/and that hand is wide. KTo has a ton of issues, especially OOP. Odds are based off what I now know from this one hand that you are fairly loose. Are you?

...nothing wrong w/being loose.

what would your raising range be then?
 
Delvuter

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what would your raising range be then?

I don't generally bet in SB, I do occasionally for randomization, and in those instances I will bet any suited connector 56 and up, pairs over 7's. Like I said though, in general, I am not betting in SB. I guess I do more often than not if it is folded to me.
 
duggs

duggs

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I don't generally bet in SB, I do occasionally for randomization, and in those instances I will bet any suited connector 56 and up, pairs over 7's. Like I said though, in general, I am not betting in SB. I guess I do more often than not if it is folded to me.

you shouldn't randomise, its suboptimal, you should have clear decisions with the vast majority of your range and the edge cases are split to ensure balance. that being said, if you aren't raising 77+ AT+ KJ+ here 100% of the time you are missing a hell of a lot of value, completing with QQ even occasionally is such a massive mistake.

i would complete with 22-55 and raise 76s+ K7+ Q8+ 79s+ 78o+ 77+ A5+ J7s+
 
BluffMeAllIn

BluffMeAllIn

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Yeah, easily should have isolated in this spot. I am not even sure what was going through my head to see the river and not instantly vbet since pretty much only a backdoor flush or a QT has me beat while there are many worse hands going to call a bet there given the fishiness.

In the situation of vbet, are we ever folding if vil raises river unless its like a rediculous shove or huge raise?
 
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doomasiggy

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Yeah, easily should have isolated in this spot. I am not even sure what was going through my head to see the river and not instantly vbet since pretty much only a backdoor flush or a QT has me beat while there are many worse hands going to call a bet there given the fishiness.

In the situation of vbet, are we ever folding if vil raises river unless its like a rediculous shove or huge raise?

Nah. Pretty bad to do that given our line.
 
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