100NL KK vs TAP

gamedemon

gamedemon

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KK Hand versus Tight-Aggr/Passive... 15/9.8/1.5 plays solid hands only; big stack.


full tilt poker Game #9601606527: Table Gemstone - $0.50/$1 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:18:51 ET - 2008/12/20
Seat 1: shaq1337 ($283.65)
Seat 2: csfalcon18 ($103)
Seat 3: wquan1979 ($20)
Seat 4: gamedemon ($114.15)
Seat 5: Westavo ($40)
Seat 6: Bill66888 ($20)
Seat 7: starAA1 ($17.80)
Seat 8: Teddy Um ($57.65)
Seat 9: MasterPUA ($250.05)
Teddy Um posts the small blind of $0.50
MasterPUA posts the big blind of $1
Westavo posts $1
Bill66888 posts $1
The button is in seat #7
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to gamedemon [Kh Kc]
shaq1337 raises to $5.50
csfalcon18 folds
wquan1979 folds
gamedemon has 15 seconds left to act
gamedemon raises to $10
Westavo folds
Bill66888 folds
starAA1 folds
Teddy Um folds
MasterPUA folds
shaq1337 calls $4.50
*** FLOP *** [9c Qh 3s]
shaq1337 checks
gamedemon has 15 seconds left to act
gamedemon bets $10
shaq1337 calls $10
*** TURN *** [9c Qh 3s] [9d]
shaq1337 checks

What is your play? I put him on AQ, with only small chance he has something like A 9. However, I also am afraid that a bet here makes him fold as he is passive.
 
Stu_Ungar

Stu_Ungar

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I would check.

I think AQ is very likely but A9, QQ or 99 could be out there.

If its the latter then you are either beat or virtually beat so he will call any bet.

If an A comes on the turn, you are beat.

You are in a situation where, if the river isnt an ace then the situation really dosnt change. So I think its worth checking the turn and then betting the river.

The pot is getting quite large in relation to the your hand strength so again the check is usefull for pot control. You cant fold the hand but its getting out of line with the pot size.
 
zachvac

zachvac

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KK Hand versus Tight-Aggr/Passive... 15/9.8/1.5 plays solid hands only; big stack.
Can you define what Aggr/Passive means? Isn't this an oxymoron?

Full Tilt Poker Game #9601606527: Table Gemstone - $0.50/$1 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:18:51 ET - 2008/12/20
Seat 1: shaq1337 ($283.65)
Seat 2: csfalcon18 ($103)
Seat 3: wquan1979 ($20)
Seat 4: gamedemon ($114.15)
Seat 5: Westavo ($40)
Seat 6: Bill66888 ($20)
Seat 7: starAA1 ($17.80)
Seat 8: Teddy Um ($57.65)
Seat 9: MasterPUA ($250.05)
Teddy Um posts the small blind of $0.50
MasterPUA posts the big blind of $1
Westavo posts $1
Bill66888 posts $1
The button is in seat #7
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to gamedemon [Kh Kc]
shaq1337 raises to $5.50
csfalcon18 folds
wquan1979 folds
gamedemon has 15 seconds left to act
gamedemon raises to $10
Please 3-bet much much larger. I make it like 16ish here.
Westavo folds
Bill66888 folds
starAA1 folds
Teddy Um folds
MasterPUA folds
shaq1337 calls $4.50
*** FLOP *** [9c Qh 3s]
shaq1337 checks
gamedemon has 15 seconds left to act
gamedemon bets $10
This is a pretty dry flop, don't see him folding a Q or calling with much worse than a Q. I definitely bet more than half pot here. Maybe 15 or so?

shaq1337 calls $10
*** TURN *** [9c Qh 3s] 9♦
shaq1337 checks

What is your play? I put him on AQ, with only small chance he has something like A 9. However, I also am afraid that a bet here makes him fold as he is passive.
I just keep betting. It's a dry board but I can see AQ not being able to fold. Check turn bet river's a fine line as well.

In general though, bet sizing should be much bigger. You basically min 3-bet him and then half pot a street where he'll basically call any sized bet with a hand he'll call any bet with. You missed a ton of value preflop and on the flop. Like I said turn-river either line is fine imo. If you check turn then I'd just call river or maybe min-raise a small bet and get AQ to pay (obviously folding to 3-bet shove).
 
A

AbstraktPB

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Make your 3bet larger preflop, at least 15. Also cbet the flop more at least 14. ( if you had 3bet larger preflop then you can get more money in on the flop and you would be jamming this turn ) as played you should be betting and jamming most rivers.
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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Yeah, what MrSticker said. It's a pretty decent way to describe people since some players make a huge distinction between how they play preflop and postflop in terms of aggression.

Anyway, I agree with what Zach said; your tiny 3-bet lets him come along for the ride with basically his entire range. That range, admittedly, ought to be pretty damn tight for a player with these stats UTG in a full ring game, but still. A lot of smaller PPs in there, including hands like TT and JJ who don't particularly want to fold the flop to a halfpot bet. Which is good for you, of course.
 
A

ArminDeluxe

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i would go all in hoping somebody´s calling who have only one high pair and good kicker, and who think u bluff
 
gamedemon

gamedemon

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Thanks for the advice...

Zach - I'm describing him as tight aggressive preflop and passive post-flop. Which is why my radar goes up when he stays in the hand.

Looking back my 3Bet was way too low....

Here's a bit more of the hand.... I did check the Turn...

...hand continued...
shaq1337 checks
gamedemon checks
*** RIVER *** [9c Qh 3s 9d] [Th]
shaq1337 bets $29
???

...
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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If you check back the turn, you kinda have to call the river. He could be valubetting AQ and even KQs.

But: if he can't have KQs, and if AQ is as likely as 99-AA, and he wouldn't bet JJ on this river or ever bluff, then the combination distribution looks like this:

Hands you beat - AQ: 12 combos
Hands that beat you - 99, TT, QQ, AA: 1 + 3 + 3 + 6 = 13 combos.

So your hand figures to be best just shy of half the time - and you only need to win more 33% of the time to call a pot sized bet on the river. It's an easy call on the river.
 
P

pkrook

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its always difficult..

to predict outcomes when randomness factors in, whether your leading or behind, the end result can always be win lose or draw...
 
gamedemon

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Frederik - you are 100% correct... had to call in this spot. In my head I didn't bet enough earlier in the hand to knock him off it, but I was also trying to extract as many chips as possible.

shaq1337 bets $29
gamedemon calls $29
*** SHOW DOWN ***
shaq1337 shows [Td Tc] a full house, Tens full of Nines
gamedemon mucks
shaq1337 wins the pot ($98.50) with a full house, Tens full of Nines
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $101.50 | Rake $3
Board: [9c Qh 3s 9d Th]
Seat 1: shaq1337 showed [Td Tc] and won ($98.50) with a full house, Tens full of Nines
Seat 2: csfalcon18 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: wquan1979 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: gamedemon mucked [Kh Kc] - two pair, Kings and Nines
Seat 5: Westavo folded before the Flop
Seat 6: Bill66888 folded before the Flop
Seat 7: starAA1 (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 8: Teddy Um (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 9: MasterPUA (big blind) folded before the Flop

He had pocket 10s and hit one on the river...
 
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