100max weird preflop shove

joosebuck

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villian short buys and shoves the first hand. can we call this?

pokerstars Game #9691030056: Hold'em No Limit ($0.50/$1.00) - 2007/04/30 - 22:59:31 (ET)
Table 'Sojourner' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: moesses ($25 in chips)
Seat 2: jenkath ($34 in chips)
Seat 3: dawojo ($25 in chips)
Seat 4: Senecady ($95.50 in chips)
Seat 5: DavidM36 ($104.95 in chips)
Seat 6: Aaron D.G. ($127.75 in chips)
Seat 7: joosebucklol ($106.80 in chips)
Seat 8: AmySlider ($29.15 in chips)
Seat 9: auswidecomp ($43.10 in chips)
dawojo: posts small blind $0.50
Senecady: posts big blind $1
moesses: posts big blind $1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joosebucklol [Jc Ah]
DavidM36: folds
Aaron D.G.: folds
joosebucklol: calls $1
AmySlider: folds
auswidecomp: folds
moesses: raises $24 to $25 and is all-in
jenkath: folds
dawojo: folds
Senecady: folds
joosebucklol:
 
t1riel

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Why did you limp in with A,J? I would have re-raised.

It sounds like one of those "double up or bust" players. Tough one here. I would fold. le thim take your dollar. See what he does in future hands.
 
joosebuck

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AJo ep = limp for me. im new to the table & am currently getting reads so not getting out of line with marginal oop raises.
 
ChuckTs

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Limp is fine, obv. We don't want to be OOP with a bloated pot and a marginal hand.

I probably just fold this and hope he pulls that again. I think we can wait for a better spot; generally someone who's this crazy will do shit like that later on and you can jump in then. No reads, no call for me.
 
mrsnake3695

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If he turns out to be the kind of player that pushes everytime he gets a semi decent hand, the chances are that you won't get anouther opportunity. Everyone else sees what he's doing and will start calling him so unless you pick up AA, KK AK in the next couple of hands you prob won't get another chance at him. Having said that AJ is too weak unless you feel like gambling. A shove like this is either PP 22 thru QQ or AK AQ, unless he just shoves with any 2 cards and hope to get lucky (which is what I am leaning towards).

I'd be interesting in knowing what happened as more hands were played. Was he a total maniac/idiot and how long before he was busted or doubled?
 
hott_estelle

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villian short buys and shoves the first hand. can we call this?


No. With no reads, AJ is still nothing but a marginal hand. AK you could think about it. AJ no need to think about it. Fold.
 
joosebuck

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only lasted one hand. i called and he had 79o and i took his monies.
 
hott_estelle

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Such a maniac joose. But if you had a feeling that you had him, then I won't say it was horrible. I go by my instincts too most of the time. Anyways---

Nice call (this time). He was probably some higher stakes player, who was on tilt from some bad beats, and just wanted to push all-in, but at lower stakes so he bought in for quarter at $100 table. I'm guessing that's what happened.

However, a lot of the times, people that buyin for quarter buyin, are those who don't want to risk their BR--and should be playing lower stakes, but too impatient and want to win more money now--and are complete rocks, who play only premium hands. That's why I still say fold for most situations there. You don't have anything invested in the pot, and well with AJ most of the time at best in that situation your 50-50 or 60-40. Considering you believe you're better than most players at that table, there's no need to go 50-50 preflop, for $25 there, when you only have $1 invested in the pot. So I still say fold, for most situations.

But obv, you got all the money in there, so it worked out for you.
 
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skoldpadda

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I would never call this. You're not even that much of a favorite. I agree with all the Estelle said re: only $1 invested, if you're better wait for better situation.
 
joosebuck

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yea but it's not that far of a stretch to see a maniac sit down quarter-bought in that wants a quick double up and will do this with any ace or medium king. theres a moderate chance that im either dominating him or racing. barely any chance im far behind.

since most agree this was too loose a call, what range do you call with?
 
hott_estelle

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KK and AA everytime, QQ and AK possibly (all depending on situation and how many people left to act behind me), JJ and AQ would be stretching it, but AJ is a definite no, it isn't even close to being a borderline call with AJ in most situations.
 
Schatzdog

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I would have thought that at best you were flipping. I'm folding that about 100% of the time.

Nice win though.
 
blankoblanco

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KK and AA everytime, QQ and AK possibly (all depending on situation and how many people left to act behind me)

QQ or AK is insta-call for me here. JJ, because this is weaker pairs so often. AQs is nearing the border for me. I'd have probably folded the AJo readless and just saw some more hands with the guy.

Readless, in this exact situation, my range is probably JJ+/AQs+, AQ and TT are close and could go either way.

It's just rare that this will be a big hand, because given his small stack, there are much surer ways to get the money in the pot in chunks with a big made hand instead of just shoving it pre-flop and scaring everyone away.
 
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Dorkus Malorkus

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In a donkament this is obviously an easy fold. "Wait for a better spot", and all that.

Here, it's very marginal. Generally when someone buys short and shoves the first hand, it means they're an idiot, and I'm inclined to believe AJ is ahead of the average range given villain's play here.
 
tenbob

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Yuk, I hate this. Really hate it. Especially with no reads, 100NL is where you start to find effective short stack play. All in with any pair/AK/AQ./AJ fold the rest. Thats usually the range of these guys, of course you will still get the donks that play any 2 like this, but they are fewer and farther between than the short play you find at 25 and 50. I reluctantly fold here.
 
A

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:D 1st hand on table lol

PokerStars Game #9694760960: Hold'em No Limit ($0.50/$1.00) - 2007/05/01 - 05:55:22 (ET)
Table 'Orthosie' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: dh4ls1m ($95 in chips)
Seat 3: keval9 ($100.70 in chips)
Seat 4: Ivan838383 ($133.25 in chips)
Seat 5: MrDiamont ($50.35 in chips)
Seat 6: alan1983 ($50 in chips)
Seat 7: uYNamron ($146.25 in chips)
Seat 9: chrusher97 ($92.40 in chips)
chrusher97: posts small blind $0.50
dh4ls1m: posts big blind $1
alan1983: posts big blind $1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to alan1983 [Ah Ac]
keval9: folds
Ivan838383: folds
MrDiamont: calls $1
alan1983: raises $3 to $4
uYNamron: raises $9 to $13
chrusher97: folds
dh4ls1m: folds
MrDiamont: calls $12
Amadeus333 has returned
alan1983: raises $37 to $50 and is all-in
uYNamron: raises $96.25 to $146.25 and is all-in
MrDiamont: calls $37.35 and is all-in
*** FLOP *** [2s Ts 6h]
*** TURN *** [2s Ts 6h] [9c]
*** RIVER *** [2s Ts 6h 9c] [8h]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
MrDiamont: shows [Kc Qc] (high card King)
uYNamron: shows [Qh Qd] (a pair of Queens)
uYNamron collected $0.70 from side pot
alan1983: shows [Ah Ac] (a pair of Aces)
alan1983 collected $148.50 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $152.20 Main pot $148.50. Side pot $0.70. | Rake $3
Board [2s Ts 6h 9c 8h]
Seat 1: dh4ls1m (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: keval9 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Ivan838383 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: MrDiamont showed [Kc Qc] and lost with high card King
Seat 6: alan1983 showed [Ah Ac] and won ($148.50) with a pair of Aces
Seat 7: uYNamron (button) showed [Qh Qd] and won ($0.70) with a pair of Queens
Seat 9: chrusher97 (small blind) folded before Flop
 
hott_estelle

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ????

Very nice win, but why are you posting this in joose's thread? Your hand isn't even close to the same situation as what joose ask in this thread. Not even close at all.

Shouldn't you be making another thread for your HH, instead of just randomly posting this in someone else's thread?
 
A

alan1983

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euh....i was a short stack and it was my first hand on table. Thats what the similarity was. I thought the guy with qq didnt give me much credit for a hand either because of that.

So i thought it was sort of relevant.

Anyway, no big deal... Plz mods delete post. All gd?
 
hott_estelle

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If you're going to play for $50, why play the $100 Max game? Doesn't make any sense at all.

Just move down a level and play the $50 Max game. Anyways, back to main point, no the situation isn't the same, even though it is your first hand and you are short stack compared to rest of the table.
 
joosebuck

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to be fair i did use my entire clock
 
ChuckTs

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Well it's a gamble to say the least. I personally wait for a better spot; it's pretty borderline here.
 
joosebuck

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well he most likely shoves every hand until he doubles or busts. that's why i decided to gamboool.
 
tenbob

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Assuming that this guy is an effective short stack player, it really limits the hands we can all with. I call here with 1010+ and AK. Nothing else. The only reason im not playing down as far as 77+ AJ/AQ is that we havnt raised pre-flop which actually would have made your call correct.
 
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