$100 NLHE Full Ring: Getting Re-Raised (OTF) After Flopping Trips (UTG-OOP)

Bovada Hand HOLDEM No Limit - 2015-12-31 02:44:01

Seat 1: Dealer ($104.75 in chips)
Seat 2: Small Blind ($155.55 in chips)
Seat 3: Big Blind ($121.33 in chips)
Seat 4: UTG [ME] ($98 in chips)
Seat 5: UTG+1 ($118.30 in chips)
Seat 6: UTG+2 ($102.88 in chips)
Seat 7: UTG+3 ($113.15 in chips)
Seat 8: UTG+4 ($47 in chips)
Seat 9: UTG+5 ($96 in chips)

Dealer : Set dealer [Seat 1]
Small Blind : Small Blind $0.50 [Seat 2]
Big Blind : Big blind $1 [Seat 3]

*** HOLE CARDS ***

Dealer : Card dealt to a spot [3s] [4s]
Small Blind : Card dealt to a spot [2h] [9c]
Big Blind : Card dealt to a spot [8h] [6s]
UTG [ME] : Card dealt to a spot [Kc] [Qd]
UTG+1 : Card dealt to a spot [9h] [6c]
UTG+2 : Card dealt to a spot [Jd] [5h]
UTG+3 : Card dealt to a spot [Ad] [4c]
UTG+4 : Card dealt to a spot [7d] [6d]
UTG+5 : Card dealt to a spot [9s] [Qh]
UTG [ME] : Raises $3 to $3
UTG+1 : Folds
UTG+2 : Folds
UTG+3 : Folds
UTG+4 : Calls $3
UTG+5 : Folds
Dealer : Calls $3
Small Blind : Folds
Big Blind : Calls $2

*** FLOP *** [Ts] [Ks] [Kd]

Big Blind [8h] [6s] : Checks
UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Bets $3
UTG+4 [7d] [6d] : Folds
Dealer [3s] [4s] : Raises $15 to $15
Big Blind [8h] [6s] : Folds
UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Calls $12

*** TURN *** [Ts] [Ks] [Kd] [5d]

UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Checks
Dealer [3s] [4s] : Checks

*** RIVER *** [Ts] [Ks] [Kd] [5d] [As]

UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Checks
Dealer [3s] [4s] : Bets $25.25
UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : ****


- Did the Villain make a better hand or is he taking advantage of his position and our passive play?

- Should we call, raise, or fold?

- Did we miss our opportunity to take down this pot?

- I will post my actions and the results of the hand after people are given time to interact with this thread.

Any reads? On the river he's basically repping QJ and missed diamond draws maybe a few weirdly played monsters or a worse Kx if he's bad.

Personally I'm never in a million years folding this river just on absolute hand strength alone. We have trips and he checked the turn. Maaaaybe could have gotten away on the turn but definitely by the river if he just kept barreling. The turn check is so suspicious and like you said, he's on the button where players can get out of line without realizing what hands they're repping.

Honestly I think you chop a lot, lose to 55/QJ a lot, but also see enough hands that make no sense (weak kings, even Ax, absolute garbage etc) that you have to call here.

I'll post a response but just letting you know that by posting the cards of villain you essentially posted results.

I would argue that you could 3b flop since there are many draws and maybe even worse kings that could call. If not 3b flop you definitely should be betting turn for value. For all the 10x that you make fold, you charge so many draws.

Bitowl - why would he show up with busted diamond draws here? What information tells you that he has diamonds? I think he definitely shows up with spades here but as played I would call. You do best a lot of random nonsense, your hand being played so weakly he probably thinks he can get you off it.

@Metsdude396

Thanks for pointing that out and my apologies to all.

I completely forgot to censor his hand and it looks like I used my one and only edit...

In regards to the hand I agree that I should of led out on the turn. My thought was to see what his play was on the turn (to get a better understanding of what he was holding) considering that he re-raised so aggressively on the flop. Had he bet on the turn I would of most likely re-raised him then considering the turn card held little value. His check in essence reassured me that I had him but the river was one I could have done without seeing.

My apologies again for screwing this thing up

Edits work for I think 30 minutes after the original post. Take the quarter pot bets out of your game on four way flops imo. Also, it takes more than a soft table to play KQo under the gun. You need to be a pretty strong player as well.

Why are you posting all the hole cards? Also not a fan of checking the turn. So many draws that are going to pay a bet on the turn that fold when they miss on the river.

@DunningKruger

Thanks for the information regarding edits.

I also appreciate the input in regards to bet sizing. I agree that in such position a weak bet puts you at a disadvantage and ripe pickings for stronger players.

In regards to playing KQo UTG
would you have folded pre?
do you try and chase him off with a 3 bet on the flop? & turn?
what do you do in my situation on the river?

I understand the question is almost pointless considering that you know his holdings but if you can give an honest and unbiased opinion knowing the facts i'd like to hear them.

WVHillbilly said:

Why are you posting all the hole cards? Also not a fan of checking the turn. So many draws that are going to pay a bet on the turn that fold when they miss on the river.

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It was an accident, I might as well take the thread down.

What's your bet on the turn WVHillbilly?

OnTheRiV3R said:

It was an accident, I might as well take the thread down.

What's your bet on the turn WVHillbilly?

Click to expand...

Well if my math is right the pot is $41, so I'd probably bet $30 on the turn.

WVHillbilly said:

Well if my math is right the pot is $41, so I'd probably bet $30 on the turn.

Click to expand...

DunningKruger said:

Edits work for I think 30 minutes after the original post. Take the quarter pot bets out of your game on four way flops imo. Also, it takes more than a soft table to play KQo under the gun. You need to be a pretty strong player as well.

Click to expand...

Metsdude396 said:

I'll post a response but just letting you know that by posting the cards of villain you essentially posted results.

I would argue that you could 3b flop since there are many draws and maybe even worse kings that could call. If not 3b flop you definitely should be betting turn for value. For all the 10x that you make fold, you charge so many draws.

Click to expand...

bitowl said:

Any reads? On the river he's basically repping QJ and missed diamond draws maybe a few weirdly played monsters or a worse Kx if he's bad.

Personally I'm never in a million years folding this river just on absolute hand strength alone. We have trips and he checked the turn. Maaaaybe could have gotten away on the turn but definitely by the river if he just kept barreling. The turn check is so suspicious and like you said, he's on the button where players can get out of line without realizing what hands they're repping.

Honestly I think you chop a lot, lose to 55/QJ a lot, but also see enough hands that make no sense (weak kings, even Ax, absolute garbage etc) that you have to call here.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the input WVHillbilly!

I apologize again and if anyone knows how to take the thread down let me know, I cant seem to figure that out either.

Below is "my action" to this hand

*** RIVER *** [Ts] [Ks] [Kd] [5d] [As]
UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Checks
Dealer [3s] [4s] : Bets $25.25
UTG [Kc] [Qd] [ME] : Folds
Dealer : Return uncalled portion of bet $25.25
Table enter user
Dealer : Does not show [3s] [4s] (Flush)
Dealer : Hand result $40.40

*** SUMMARY ***

Total Pot($42.50)

Board [Ts] [Ks] [Kd] [5d] [As]

Seat+1: Dealer $40.40 [Does not show]
Seat+2: Small Blind Folded before the FLOP
Seat+3: Big Blind Folded on the FLOP
Seat+4: UTG Folded on the RIVER
Seat+5: UTG+1 Folded before the FLOP
Seat+6: UTG+2 Folded before the FLOP
Seat+7: UTG+3 Folded before the FLOP
Seat+8: UTG+4 Folded on the FLOP
Seat+9: UTG+5 Folded before the FLOP

You can't fold to the river bet, imo. Call.

OnTheRiV3R said:

In regards to playing KQo UTG
would you have folded pre?
do you try and chase him off with a 3 bet on the flop? & turn?
what do you do in my situation on the river?

I understand the question is almost pointless considering that you know his holdings but if you can give an honest and unbiased opinion knowing the facts i'd like to hear them.

Click to expand...

1) I might play it myself, but I would pretty much never advise opening it in a full ring game UTG to another player looking for help on how to play KOo utg in a full ring game. I'd be much less inclined to play it if I had already shown down a relatively (given the situation) light pre flop hand, as it only takes one to stick in ppl's minds and mess with their auto notes a bit. Anyway just be aware the open is a non standard play and there are a lot of very good reasons not to do so from that position.

2) 3betting flop is an enticing option only because it's very difficult to be behind here and it's less than 100 blinds if he has one of the very few combos of full houses. It's a two tone flop, AK often 3bets pre, TT and KT often flat call the cbet (a proper one at least), it's unlikely he can improve to a second best hand that has much value vs your perceived range on that board, and most importantly you're out of position so smooth calling loses a lot of its appeal. Flat calling to keep in possible bluffs is flawed here - we would instead call to to slow down and reevaluate based on the turn card and BTN's action, and/or to keep weak players in the pot. Neither of those make a ton of sense in this particular spot so 3bet wins for me.

3) As played, flip a coin. There are very little bluffs he can have now after raising flop, so your question is whether or not he will value bet AT+, KJ, K9s, etc. Use your reads to narrow his range and decide if you're good 28% of the time. He plays it exactly like a flush (and the A K and Ts are already out which makes it kinda gross) but even if you look him up, I think the largest mistake was simply playing the hand in the first place.

+1 to all of DKs comments. I didn't notice you were playing a full ring. KQo is not usually good enough to open UTG so it all depends on game dynamics. Also DK, villain did 3bet pre. Even so the comments make sense. If you feel like you have a right image and will get respect to barrels, maybe go ahead and open, but you should be aware of these aspects before you make the decision. You will be OOP on a Khigh flop a lot of times here so it will be an awkward spot (much better if you can get people to fold Ahigh to a cbet)

Metsdude396 said:

Also DK, villain did 3bet pre.

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I know the HH is a bit of a mess but I don't see any 3bet preflop. The flop 2bet was the first aggressive action villain made.

Whoops my apologies man you're right. Then a true +1 to everything.

Good fold. It's exploitable, but almost nothing you beat OTR. Every combo draw/naked FDs/OESDs got there. On such a wet board, trip kings (although unlikely) keeps betting. Tens full might slowplay flop, but if they raise (which they should), they keep betting turn to charge draws. When he checks behind the turn, he doesn't really have any value hands. Some might get tricky with a full house here and slooowplay though. Not too likely though. And I seriously doubt he is raising the flop with a 0%. He pretty much always has it here.

Checking turn is where u made the mistake.