$100 NLHE 6-max: Underfull in 3-bet pot 250 deep, bet sizing/line check

c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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$100 NL HE 6-max: Underfull in 3-bet pot 250 deep, bet sizing/line check

Villain is a 25/17/23%(2.5) over 760 hands. I have been abusing him pretty hard preflop since he folds to 3-bets well. He recently stacked me for 225 bb's with the nut flush when I had the second nuts, and he's most certainly winning for the session. I've also seen him bet 2nd pair on two consecutive streets after I missed a c-bet against him. Other stats:

3-bet % = 5%
3-bet pot C-bet % = 33% (6 samples)
Any other stats on request

I was having trouble putting him on a hand. What range are you putting him on after he checks 3 streets? I'm thinking like AJ/ATs/Kx? Can he be slowplaying AK or KK here? I probably should have bet the flop bigger, but I put him on a pretty weak range when he checked it.

Ultimate Bet, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 4 Players

SB: $196.08 (196.1 bb)
BB: $254.93 (254.9 bb)
Hero (CO): $243.76 (243.8 bb)
BTN: $177.90 (177.9 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is CO with 22
Hero raises to $3.50, 2 folds, BB raises to $12, Hero calls $8.50

Flop: ($24.50) A 2♠ K (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $16.75, BB calls $16.75

Turn: ($58) A♠ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $45.75, BB calls $45.75

River: ($149.50) 5♠ (2 players)
BB checks with $169 behind, Hero bets $XX???

And no crappy responses please, if you reply please at least give a range and a bet size for the river with reasons why. We've recently had some good hand discussions here, lets keep it going.
 
WVHillbilly

WVHillbilly

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I can't see this as AK/KK basically ever because I just don't ever see those hands not betting the river. Does he think you're spewy enough that he'd call twice with QQ/JJ or is this always just AJ/AQ trying to get to SD?

I think either way I bet small ~$60. It looks bluffy enough and gives decent odds to get looked up by smaller pairs if he thinks you're barrelling with air and allows us to have a no brainer call if he shoves.

Actually checking behind makes the most sense because he obviously has 3s4s!!! ;)
 
widowmaker89

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I just shove here.

If he has AA,KK,AK we are losing our stack anyway since we cant really fold. I dont think underpairs are calling 3 streets here either regardless of size.

I would expect AQ,AJ kind of hands are calling regardless, especially since he stacked you earlier he may think you want revenge. I wish his 3bet was higher but he has AJ,AQ hands in his range, maybe KsQs plays like this. He also bet, 3bet with the nuts last time on the river so I slightly discount those hands.

Overall, I think he is folding out all his hands without an A(or KK) here regardless of bet size and he is getting our stack regardless if he beats us. Based on your image and the fact he just took you for a big hand I think he is calling any A so pushing is what I would do.
 
Suited Frenzy

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6 hands beat you here after the river came. After the 2nd checkcall, I would've seemed suspicious that he 'might' have 1 of them. The pre-flop re-raise would tell me that he has a big pkt pr like kings or aces &/or A K. I always check the river if I seem suspicious that they have been slow playing; especially after 2 check calls. Even though you have a BOAT here, it is far from the 'best' hand on that scary fkn board. I would check simply because of the fact that I would've suspected a slowplay...
 
WVHillbilly

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6 hands beat you here after the river came. After the 2nd checkcall, I would've seemed suspicious that he 'might' have 1 of them. The pre-flop re-raise would tell me that he has a big pkt pr like kings or aces &/or A K. I always check the river if I seem suspicious that they have been slow playing; especially after 2 check calls. Even though you have a BOAT here, it is far from the 'best' hand on that scary fkn board. I would check simply because of the fact that I would've suspected a slowplay...

He 3bets 5% (probably a LOT more from the blinds against a likely steal) so he's 3betting a lot more than just KK+/AK. You're giving away tons of value if you're checking behind here.
 
Suited Frenzy

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He 3bets 5% (probably a LOT more from the blinds against a likely steal) so he's 3betting a lot more than just KK+/AK. You're giving away tons of value if you're checking behind here.


I didn't see that he listed the 3-bet %. That helps. If he makes loose 3-bets then I would have to put him on A Q, A J, or A 10. In sayin' that, I would bet around $50.
 
widowmaker89

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If you think 5% is loose, you need to 3bet more.

Betting 50 and calling a shove is not good imo. Do we fold to a shove? Honestly I think we would have to but why even get there.

You think he is folding AQ to a shove here against c9? You think he is calling QQ on an AK flop for 3 streets? I think 50 or 60 look more for value on this board than a bluff so I doubt we are getting that call.
 
WVHillbilly

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If you think 5% is loose, you need to 3bet more.

Betting 50 and calling a shove is not good imo. Do we fold to a shove? Honestly I think we would have to but why even get there.

You think he is folding AQ to a shove here against c9? You think he is calling QQ on an AK flop for 3 streets? I think 50 or 60 look more for value on this board than a bluff so I doubt we are getting that call.

If he's never calling underpairs, I agree just shove and expect to be called by all of his Ax hands. Trying to get value from his QQ type hands is probably worthless anyway.
 
dsvw56

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If he's never calling underpairs, I agree just shove and expect to be called by all of his Ax hands. Trying to get value from his QQ type hands is probably worthless anyway.

Agree. Just ship it and expect to get looked up by most of his Ax hands. He may fold some of the weaker ones, but I think shoving is the most +EV.
 
joos

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I make a small bet on the river and expect to get looked up by random crap. I really dont think he has that many Ax hands as we think, unless you know that he is 3b Ax for card elimination purposes. Also any timing tells? I think I would put that to use in a situation like this.
 
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