$10 NLHE Full Ring: Think I Played it Well?

The Shrog

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$10 NL HE Full Ring: Think I Played it Well?

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 13/7/2.7

OK, here's the background. The hand just before this, I got it in vs. a complete idiot with AA on 10107 with him having KQo. Now, this hand comes up against the nit.

Full Tilt, $0.05/$0.10 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 8 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker

BB: $12.25 (122.5 bb)
UTG+2: $10 (100 bb)
MP1: $20.89 (208.9 bb)
Hero (MP2): $24.84 (248.4 bb)
MP3: $4.85 (48.5 bb)
CO: $26.53 (265.3 bb)
BTN: $11.59 (115.9 bb)
SB: $13.19 (131.9 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is MP2 with A
club.gif
K
club.gif

2 folds, Hero raises to $0.40, 2 folds, BTN calls $0.40, SB folds, BB calls $0.30

Flop: ($1.25) 2
club.gif
6
spade.gif
T
club.gif
(3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.70, BTN raises to $2.40, BB folds, Hero calls $1.70

Turn: ($6.05) T
spade.gif
(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($6.05) J
club.gif
(2 players)
Hero bets $2.50, BTN raises to $5.50

The player here requested time on the flop before raising. First of all, should we have gotten it in here? I feel like he has to have a set, or MAYBE JJ. The turn, he checks behind pretty quickly. On the river I wanted to ch/call at first, but then decided to bet a small amount and fold to a raise. Again, he requests time and puts in this small raise, leaving him a little behind..and screaming for a call.

Thoughts on ALL streets?
 
Lemlywinks

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This hand really looks like a set to me Shrog. I don't think he limps JJ+ on the BTN, so that leaves a setmining 22, or 66.

I don't see myself folding during the hand, but now that I look at it I just don't know what you beat. Maybe KQc??

btw I like how you played all 3 streets
 
WVHillbilly

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I probably just get it in on the flop. How many hands do you have on him? Enough to know how often he raises the river?

As played I probably call because I'm a station and it's $3 in a $14 pot. You don't have to be right very often (not that I think you'll be good a ton here).
 
WVHillbilly

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How many times did you post this hand???
 
The Shrog

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I don't see myself folding during the hand, but now that I look at it I just don't know what you beat. Maybe KQc??

I have the Kc.

How many times did you post this hand???

Sorry, kept editing..it's only shown up once on mine.
 
The Shrog

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260 hands on him. I just don't see anything that we beat on the river.
 
WVHillbilly

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260 is not enough to know how often he bets the river. I guess you can fold. Like I said though I wouldn't.

Great odds and well I just have to see his JJ.
Boats are pretty!
 
ImolAyrton

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The things you say about villain means that he is a very aggresive player.. After the check-check on the turn its almost certainly that he will rerais a river bet because he doesnt believe you. I would have check-call a bet from this guy.
 
F Paulsson

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I don't really know how people play at $10NL, but before I go ahead and give him credit for a set, a full house or quads, I'd need to be very certain that he's not doing this for value with a weaker hand, i.e. a weaker flush or even trips.

With not too much generosity I can give him at least 4 flushes with suited connectors, and on the other side of that we have him with 7 combos of sets/quads (if we think he wouldn't play JJ this way). We need to have the best hand only 18% of the time to call. And if he can have a smaller flush then we're looking at 35%+ equity. It seems a really easy call to me. I doubt there's value in shoving, though.
 
benevg

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i would have check-called the river (hindsight, at the table - who knows), but as it is, i really can't find a fold here. $3 in a $14 pot is just too little to give up this hand... i wouldn't shove because of the several full houses he could have, but a call is in order.
 
JimmyBrizzy

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Any insight on the thought process behind calling the flop and what range you put him on after check raising you there? And if possible what your plan was for certain turns?
 
F Paulsson

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Any insight on the thought process behind calling the flop and what range you put him on after check raising you there? And if possible what your plan was for certain turns?

Oh yeah, about the flop play: I don't see why we're not shoving the flop. There should be plenty of fold equity to pick up, our hot/cold equity can't be worse than 25% (and higher against his entire calling range) and we're out of position.
 
WVHillbilly

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Oh yeah, about the flop play: I don't see why we're not shoving the flop. There should be plenty of fold equity to pick up, our hot/cold equity can't be worse than 25% (and higher against his entire calling range) and we're out of position.

I'm unfamiliar with this term. Please explain.

I said the same in the other thread Shrog posted on this hand. Shove flop, as played call river.
 
F Paulsson

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Eh, just another way of saying "showdown equity." Mostly I just say "equity" but since I had already talked about "fold equity" in the same sentence I wanted to be clear about what I meant. Instead it seems I just confused. :)
 
pedroman7

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Not a great spot against a nit but too much money in the pot to really fold an ace high flush. On the flop if you feel like your against only one pair I think it is an easy shove. Otherwise I think you played it ok except maybe I like check/calling river for pot control and to induce a bluff
 
Stu_Ungar

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Id say a FH. 22 66 or Quads TT

The reason is the reraise on the flop. He is protecting from the FD

On the turn he hits FH /Quads but basically has the nuts.

He checks it down hoping that you either bluff the river or the flush card comes and you try and bet it for value.

You describe him as a nit, nits dont reraise flops unless they have a big hand and want you to fold because they dont like getting outdrawn.

Notice his fear of the FD disappears on the turn? .. he improves with the T

SO preflop is fine.

C-betting the flop is also fine.... but from then on it goes downhill.
 
Last edited:
kleitches

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I don't really know how people play at $10NL, but before I go ahead and give him credit for a set, a full house or quads, I'd need to be very certain that he's not doing this for value with a weaker hand, i.e. a weaker flush or even trips.

With not too much generosity I can give him at least 4 flushes with suited connectors, and on the other side of that we have him with 7 combos of sets/quads (if we think he wouldn't play JJ this way). We need to have the best hand only 18% of the time to call. And if he can have a smaller flush then we're looking at 35%+ equity. It seems a really easy call to me. I doubt there's value in shoving, though.

FP, could you show us the math behind how you figured the 18% and 35%?
 
benevg

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FP, could you show us the math behind how you figured the 18% and 35%?
that one is easy - if you pay $3 to win $14, you need to be right 18% of the time to break even. (3 times out of 17 = 17.6%) so even if you are wrong most of the time, the few times you win are going to be worth it.
if he can have 4 flushes and 7 hands FH or better, then we win 4/11 times, or about 36% of the hands.
is that explanation enough? :)
 
Goodwooter

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villian checked the turn which means he was scared of that second 10...which also means he had the flop 10 beaten...JJ is possible which has you beat...QQ is most likely...KK or AA you would have been reraised preflop...in any case...i think you have to pay to see JJ on the river
 
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