$10 NLHE Full Ring: QQ facing UTG Open & MP 3-bet

$10 NL HE Full Ring: QQ facing UTG Open & MP 3-bet

UTG opener is 13/6/1.3 and the 3-bettor is 18/5/1.5 with a 3bet of 2. What is our play here? I considered a 4-bet but thought I would have to fold to a shove. At the same time, I really hate overcalling.

Also, for whatever reason, looks like the converter messed up. The open is UTG and the 3bet is from MP.


BB: $13.79 (137.9 bb)
MP2: $19.77 (197.7 bb)
CO: $12.30 (123 bb)
BTN: $10.10 (101 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is with Q Q
MP2 raises to $0.30, CO folds, BTN raises to $1

Ok, I am editing. I don't know what I did for the converter.

Basically, FR 10nl table, and I gave the stats for the UTG and the MP players. Based on these stats PF, what's our move?

Sample size is the most important think here.
If u only have like 50-100 hands on both villain i think there is still alot of value in our hand since the 3bet stat prolly isnt acuriate yet and if we only have such a small sample the chance of both/one of them having some spazy tendency´s we dont know about is allways there vs 10nl players.
Also the fact your 4handed changes thinks alitle since villains MIGHT be adjusting to SH by opening up...

If we actualy have a decent sample on villains and know they dont adjust to SH this a obvs. fold.

btw are we BTN or BB in this hand since that makes a huge difrence in if where flatting or 4betting(when/if we decited to play the hand that is)

4betting and folding to a shove sucks iyam

consider that you're 4-handed, so QQ is kinda an enormous hand in this spot

i think i 4b/call it off

The Shrog said:

UTG opener is 13/6/1.3 and the 3-bettor is 18/5/1.5 with a 3bet of 2. What is our play here? I considered a 4-bet but thought I would have to fold to a shove. At the same time, I really hate overcalling.

Also, for whatever reason, looks like the converter messed up. The open is UTG and the 3bet is from MP.


BB: $13.79 (137.9 bb)
MP2: $19.77 (197.7 bb)
CO: $12.30 (123 bb)
BTN: $10.10 (101 bb)

Pre-Flop: Hero is with Q

Q

MP2 raises to $0.30, CO folds, BTN raises to $1

Click to expand...

Fold.

a 2% 3bet is AA-JJ maybe AK, AA- KK or something like that.

You cant fold to a shove and QQ is towards the bottom of his 3-bet range.

It sucks QQ is a big hand but he has a really small 3-bet range.

Stu_Ungar said:

Fold.

a 2% 3bet is AA-JJ maybe AK, AA- KK or something like that.

You cant fold to a shove and QQ is towards the bottom of his 3-bet range.

It sucks QQ is a big hand but he has a really small 3-bet range.

Click to expand...

dude its 4-handed 10nl, are you serious

vanquish said:

dude its 4-handed 10nl, are you serious

Click to expand...

Yeah... well im assuming that the reason its 4-handed is that the table has just lost a few players.

10 NL players dont adapt all that much all that quickly.

The 3-betters stats are 18/5/1.5

He isnt all that aggressive and he has a really tight opeing range, so for him to 3-bet.. its a big deal.

Stu_Ungar said:

Yeah... well im assuming that the reason its 4-handed is that the table has just lost a few players.

10 NL players dont adapt all that much all that quickly.

The 3-betters stats are 18/5/1.5

He isnt all that aggressive and he has a really tight opeing range, so for him to 3-bet.. its a big deal.

Click to expand...

If the sample is 100 hands or something there is no way 3betting % has converged and VP/PRF is still not acuriate, thats why sample size matter alot here imo.

And just cause its 4handed doesnt mean they just lost players, maybe they just started a table...

Stu_Ungar said:

Yeah... well im assuming that the reason its 4-handed is that the table has just lost a few players.

10 NL players dont adapt all that much all that quickly.

The 3-betters stats are 18/5/1.5

He isnt all that aggressive and he has a really tight opeing range, so for him to 3-bet.. its a big deal.

Click to expand...

so do u fold KK here too?

I think this is a full table...

"Ok, I am editing. I don't know what I did for the converter.

Basically, FR 10nl table, and I gave the stats for the UTG and the MP players"

I agree with stu.

This is 10NL nobody is 3-betting light. 4-betting is only going to get shoved on by better hands. If you can't let it go, just flat the 3-bet and never fold on the flop.

even if no one is 3betting light that doesn't mean they're not 3betting stuff like 88 and 99 for value

OK lets hack this out

Scenario 1:
QQ vs JJ+,AKo,AKs
equity 47.3% to 52.6%

Scenario 2:
QQ vs 88+,AKo,AKs
Equity 58.8% to 41.1%

So if you think this guy is 3-betting wider than Scenario 1 then you might be making a profit. Even though it is only a hundred hands though, I think a 2% 3-bet stat still tells of something about his range.

However lets say that Scenario 2 is correct; is 4-betting still the best considering that we may still get shoved on only by better hands?

i think i would need a little more information.. like how high the blinds are compared to my stack and how each player has been playing and what theyre callin with.. a QQ here definately deserves a nice raise to ward of weak starting draw hands

Sorry guys..I caused a bunch of commotion over a mis-type. The converter messed up but I had already posted. This is at a FULL RING game.

basically u guise who are saying fold must be the biggest nits ever

if its 9 handed i fold, if its 4 handed i 4bet/call

fwiw im never ever folding here im 4-betting without a doubt.

but i would like to add i highly doubt that 10nl players know to loosen up 4 handed but since its 10nl and pretty much every player is bad i dont have a problem 4 betting.

Possibly, your 4bet can provoke all-in, therefore call here is cheaper and simple decision.

If it's full ring I'm flatting the 3bet. If UTG re-raises or shoves I fold.

I will bet 90% of the pot on almost any flop after a short delay and fold to any shoves unless it's a low card flop in which case I bet/call UTG shove and bet/fold button shove.

If we flop a set I bet like 20-25% of the pot to induce a raise from KK/AA/ or a call from a stubborn AK...who also might bluff/raise a small bet....but that's doubtful.

If flop has ace or king I check fold because the likelihood neither of them has some sort of ace or king in their hand is minimal