$10 NLHE Full Ring: AQ TPTK facing 3 barrels on dry board

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mottotom27

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Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 14/12/62

[converted_hand][hand_history]poker stars, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #35406831

BTN: $10 (100 bb)
SB: $10.45 (104.5 bb)
Hero (BB): $10 (100 bb)
UTG+1: $104.29 (1,042.9 bb)
UTG+2: $18.23 (182.3 bb)
MP1: $7.60 (76 bb)
MP2: $10.38 (103.8 bb)
MP3: $26.83 (268.3 bb)
CO: $19.75 (197.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q<font color='red'>♥</font> A<font color='black'>♠</font>
5 folds, CO raises to $0.30, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.65) A<font color='red'>♥</font> 7<font color='black'>♣</font> T<font color='red'>♦</font> (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $0.40, Hero calls $0.40

Turn: ($1.45) 4<font color='red'>♥</font> (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $0.75, Hero calls $0.75

River: ($2.95) 2<font color='black'>♣</font> (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $1.90, Hero calls $1.90

Villain 14/12/62 over 100 hands. preflop i called instead of 3betting to keep his dominated hands in that might fold if i raise. flop and turn i think are standard calls i feel he barrels mostly worse aces and i lose only to AK, sets, a few two pairs like A7.

i called river because it was a complete brick (no draws got there) and villain had quite high AFq and also my WSD after river call showed up as too high in leakbuster so wanted to bring it down a bit.

but realistically i don't know if he would bet worse for value (AJ?) and it's a terrible spot to bluff since it's kinda obvious i have an ace when i call two streets.

i'm thinking now maybe leading out for half pot or less (and fold to raise) is the best move on the river to get value from worse Ax that might have checked behind, what do you guys think?
 
John A

John A

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You should be betting a little more on the turn. About .90-1.1. On the river, if you are planning on calling, then you should be betting instead. The only reason you should be c/cing is if you're snapping off bluffs. Like you said yourself here, it's not a place for someone to bluff... THUS (and it's an important thus) you need to be bet /folding rather than c/cing. Bet / fold ~ $2 would be perfect here.

You got this man... you're using the tools you need to and you're putting this thing together. It's good you're focusing on this aspect of your game because it's really important to get this nailed down.
 
atlantafalcons0

atlantafalcons0

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Being OOP kills us in this spot, I'd rather check raise the flop than just check call all day long.
 
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mottotom27

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You should be betting a little more on the turn. About .90-1.1.

Well i'm not the preflop aggressor but i agree leading out turn instead of x/c again is probably a better play. and then leading river too. This can probably also balance for the times that we take the x/c then lead turn line with draws and weaker hands.

You got this man... you're using the tools you need to and you're putting this thing together. It's good you're focusing on this aspect of your game because it's really important to get this nailed down.

Thanks, i'm really trying! I think calling down the river more is definitely helping my game, i've picked up quite a few bluffs recently by thinking more about my opponent's range.
 
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mottotom27

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i think it's debatable. By flatting we keep in his dominated hands like AT/A9 which we're ahead of. If i was confident that villain defends those sorts of hands to a 3bet then i would but i'm not sure about here. i think you can probably go either way. Flatting has the advantage of disguising the strength of our hand somewhat
 
Aces2w1n

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Being OOP, 3bet preflop

+1... And if we lead out on the flop we hoping to end the hand right there. No need to get too tricky OOP here :)

Also against decent opponents we can fold troublesome hands OOP
 
Aces2w1n

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Villain 14/12/62 over 100 hands

You really need to start looking at more than just the overall figure but really looking at whether he's opening range expands on the CO/Button which normally is a case with people who know that their doing. because their 14% overall, they still could be 20+% on button and CO but mega tight in EP MP. Each position his opening % should be different.

Food for thought :)
 
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mottotom27

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villain actually has a high steal % over this relatively small sample. i'm not worried about us being ahead of his range, it's whether or not we're ahead of his 3bet calling range. I think we probably have a slight equity advantage given he can flat with dominated AJ and KQ and perhaps a few other speculative hands, so there's definitely nothing wrong with it. But i flatted to keep all the worse Ax hands in his range like A9/AT and QJ/QT that would mostly fold to a 3bet, since there is lots of value to be made vs those hands if i hit one of my outs since my hand is so underrepped.

i'm not sure about leading flop. i mean he's aggressive so why not give him a chance to cbet? he can cbet with his entire range, whereas if i lead out i might lose value from these bluffs. however by the turn it's less likely for him to bluff so there i agree leading out is better than check/calling.
 
Aces2w1n

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It doesn't look like a great board for him to bluff at... Unless he's known to bet with total air.

It looks like if your checking setting your opponent to bluff, it appears your setting yourself up for disaster. Sometimes theres time you need to defend your best hand sir and this is it.

What hands do you think he's going to bet with here seriously? ... I'm not afraid to bet with pocket 6's in this spot but he's not me :) and if my 6 hits on the turn... i'm trapping you.
 
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mottotom27

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i think cbetting flop is +EV for him. in that spot i'd be calling most broadways, some decent Ax, pocket pairs 66-TT (i only defend suited connectors against weaker players). given it's a rainbow board he can get me to fold most of my broadway hands like KQ, KJ etc, as well as most of my pocket pairs. So i'd say sets and Ax make up less than half my range in this spot so it's actually a pretty standard cbet in his shoes. If the board was two toned then it's a little closer.

By the turn once i call i basically turn my hand face up as Ax or a set, so he'd be stupid to keep betting there without at least a good ace. So assuming he's fairly competent i agree with John in hindsight that bet/folding turn is better than check/calling.
 
Figaroo2

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What hands are you choosing to 3bet from the blinds generally?
I don't mind flatting AQ as its difficult to know what you do if you get 4 bet. whether or not to lead the turn would depend on his turn cbet % for me. If it's high cc and low then lead out.
I would have played the turn as you did and then lead out on the river in case he chooses to check behind on the end. I want that thin value on the end here. (did JohnA notice you were oop)
If you have been overbet leading out on the turn with weaker hands im not sure this is a good hand for that. I prefer a mostly air with outs or occasional nuts polarised range for that play.
 
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mottotom27

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yea i do often 3bet AQ from the blinds but i sometimes like to flat too. his turn cbet is 100% but only over 1 hand so not enough to go on. i don't tend to use that stat too much since it takes a while to get a reasonable sample on someone. i just don't imagine too many regs to be barrelling A high boards after i check/call one street, although i guess it's possible some of the weaker regs might be doing this.

tbh i don't think i've ever used the overbet lead turn line, have you tried it and is it effective? but i do sometimes x/c and then lead for 1/2 to 2/3 pot on dry boards vs steals and i've had quite a bit of success with that line over a small sample. i've also tried some small 2-2.5x check raises in those spots, that's also worked pretty well. i'm not sure which line is best tbh with regards to EV due to small sample. do you know?
 
Figaroo2

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In my experience if you are looking to take it down on the turn then leading out is better than CR simply because they will have put much less money in the pot so they feel less committed to it. The CR is much more confrontational as well and some people still dislike it as a tactic and may react stubbornly.
The overbet lead confuses regs and I find if they will normally commit to either folding or reraising.
I have a good example of the turn overbet lead I ran against a really good reg recently I will post it when I get home later.
 
Figaroo2

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This was a good hand to post as our hand has medium value and we should I think be betting for value bearing in mind its LP v BB. I know I have got caught myself here with A8 or similar on the button and paid off a higher kicker dozens of times on an ace rag board.
But like I said above this hand isn't the right strength for the overbet lead on the turn. John's turn sizing looks good but im not sure its really important to lead the turn as long as you lead on the river.
 
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