Originally Posted by OMGITSOVER9K
yeah you dominate his range but do you dominate the range he calls a 3bet with?
most likely not.. 3betting because we play bad OOP seems kinda bad as well tbf, we get a bunch of folds but when we're flatted/4bet it sucks.
people have different games and in that different strengths/leaks, but for 95% of people against this villain flatting is the best option.
Respectfully completely disagree. I wrote about this the other day actually, and it's something that went into my book because is such a bad widely accepted misnomer imho. I literally wrote over 20 pages on blind play and broke it into "learning blind" play, and optimal blind play. When you 3-bet:
1) Most of the time your opponent is folding pre-flop, and you're picking up those bets without a flop.
2) When your opponent does call, you have initiative, and continuation bets in re-raised pots at micro and most smaller stake games will have more respect.
3) You're not crushed when your opponent does decide to call. You're maybe at a 40/60 equity disadvantage (using KJo as an example), and you have initiative. If your opponent calls with KQ, and you both whiff, most of the time a c-bet will take down the pot and make your opponent fold a hand where they have a huge equity advantage. You don't have to get pot stuck if you only flop top pair (depending on your hand).
Now of course if your opponent has a really low fold to 3-bet, or it's someone who is extremely tricky, likes to float, etc... then 3-betting isn't your first option. But I can tell you with 100% confidence that for a lot of players, especially at these stakes, it's better to 3-bet, then call or fold because most players aren't playing ideally OOP. This also comes from having coached a lot of players in over 8 years and I see what marginal winners struggle with.
Ideally like I said, you want to learn to flat, but you can't learn and continue to grow in poker if you don't have a bankroll. So you need to take smart steps to grow your bankroll and expand your game, rather than take every line that is "most optimal" because good players take those lines. 3-betting is still +EV, and it's better than calling and losing a bigger pot or playing hit or fold poker (which a lot of players at these stakes do).
Just an FYI... I've looked at all of the stats for winning regs, marginal winning players, and losing players. Most people struggle with flatting these hands OOP except for better winning regulars. Right now as we speak, Leak Buster is grinding 50 million + micro stake hands of no-limit to generate updated ranges. And I've looked through data in the previous 3 years at 100 million + each when we updated stats the previous two times that proved my point above.
There are a ton of lines and plays I take or make that I wouldn't advocate other players to take. Even though I know it's more optimal, it won't be +EV for a lot of players that don't have a really firm grasp of hand ranges, equity, and how to properly exploit different player types.