$10 NLHE 6-max: KK on a Q high board reraised on the flop

$10 NL HE 6-max: KK on a Q high board reraised on the flop

My HEM is down right now so no stats and this guy hadn't been at the table very long, so I didn't have much to go on. What do you guys think?

Stage #1283339231: Holdem No Limit $0.10 - 2009-02-26 14:34:23 (ET)
Table: DIAMOND DR (real money) Seat #2 is the dealer
Seat 2 - GUIDUGLI ($15.88 in chips)
Seat 3 - ANNABELLE28 ($6.56 in chips)
Seat 4 - CHEFDAVID1 ($14.08 in chips)
Seat 5 - MKSDZ ($10.74 in chips)
Seat 6 - DCRYS1979 ($30.37 in chips)
Seat 1 - ODENFAN ($5.04 in chips)
ANNABELLE28 - Posts small blind $0.05
CHEFDAVID1 - Posts big blind $0.10
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to DCRYS1979 [Kd Ks]
MKSDZ - Folds
DCRYS1979 - Raises $0.30 to $0.30
ODENFAN - Folds
GUIDUGLI - Calls $0.30
ANNABELLE28 - Folds
CHEFDAVID1 - Calls $0.20
*** FLOP *** [7d 5s Qh]
CHEFDAVID1 - Checks
DCRYS1979 - Bets $0.60
GUIDUGLI - Raises $2 to $2
CHEFDAVID1 - Folds
DCRYS1979 -???

Shove.

The Shrog said:

Shove.

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Really, do you all shove that easily? I kinda like the "build a pot" line usually, but okay.

Edit: Also, with that dry of a board, wouldn't you rather build it up a little that way we don't lose value by him folding?

I think you have to raise or fold. It is kinda hard to fold this in this spot at
10nl 6max with no read. Given the stack sizes I say raise to $6 or shoving is
ok too but I think AQ is the only hand that you can beat that should even
think about calling. So I think raise to $6 and call a shove/hope they don't
have a set.

The only hands I should be worried about here are 55,77, and QQ right? Or are there some others that I'm missing?

dg1267 said:

The only hands I should be worried about here are 55,77, and QQ right? Or are there some others that I'm missing?

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75s, maybe.

slycbnew said:

75s, maybe.

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Two pr did go through my mind, but the only one that I could even consider was 75s. Who calls with that crap though?

dg1267 said:

Two pr did go through my mind, but the only one that I could even consider was 75s. Who calls with that crap though?

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I've been running into this a bit at 10NL and 25NL , even seeing the occassional Q7s or Q5s (I sort of understand 75s for implied odds, but not Qxs) - maybe it's just my "bad beat" memory over-emphasizing a few unpleasant hands...

The stats seem to make a difference - two pair here is much more likely from a 40-50/3-8 calling station/loose passive, or from a super LAG 50+/20+, and extremely unlikely from a 15/10.

This is usually TPGK, though, and I'm also raising to about $6 or $7.

dg1267 said:

Two pr did go through my mind, but the only one that I could even consider was 75s. Who calls with that crap though?

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Me, and you should too.

c9h13no3 said:

Me, and you should too.

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Ugh, why? I guess maybe on the button, but what's the idea behind it? Just the hope of a flop like this one?

For those of you that said to push, you win an all expense paid trip to valuetown! I didn't push, but my reraise did induce one from him.

Stage #1283339231: Holdem No Limit $0.10 - 2009-02-26 14:34:23 (ET)
Table: DIAMOND DR (Real Money) Seat #2 is the dealer
Seat 2 - GUIDUGLI ($15.88 in chips)
Seat 3 - ANNABELLE28 ($6.56 in chips)
Seat 4 - CHEFDAVID1 ($14.08 in chips)
Seat 5 - MKSDZ ($10.74 in chips)
Seat 6 - DCRYS1979 ($30.37 in chips)
Seat 1 - ODENFAN ($5.04 in chips)
ANNABELLE28 - Posts small blind $0.05
CHEFDAVID1 - Posts big blind $0.10
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to DCRYS1979 [Kd Ks]
MKSDZ - Folds
DCRYS1979 - Raises $0.30 to $0.30
ODENFAN - Folds
GUIDUGLI - Calls $0.30
ANNABELLE28 - Folds
CHEFDAVID1 - Calls $0.20
*** FLOP *** [7d 5s Qh]
CHEFDAVID1 - Checks
DCRYS1979 - Bets $0.60
GUIDUGLI - Raises $2 to $2
CHEFDAVID1 - Folds
DCRYS1979 - Raises $6.80 to $7.40
GUIDUGLI - All-In(Raise) $13.58 to $15.58
DCRYS1979 - Calls $8.18
*** TURN *** [7d 5s Qh] [6h]
*** RIVER *** [7d 5s Qh 6h] [10c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
GUIDUGLI - Shows [As Qs] (One pair, queens)
DCRYS1979 - Shows [Kd Ks] (One pair, kings)
DCRYS1979 Collects $30.51 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($32.11) | Rake ($1.60)
Board [7d 5s Qh 6h 10c]
Seat 1: ODENFAN Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 2: GUIDUGLI (dealer) HI:lost with One pair, queens [As Qs - P:Qs,B:Qh,P:As,B:10c,B:7d]
Seat 3: ANNABELLE28 (small blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 4: CHEFDAVID1 (big blind) Folded on the FLOP
Seat 5: MKSDZ Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 6: DCRYS1979 won Total ($30.51) HI$30.51) with One pair, kings [Kd Ks - P:Ks,P:Kd,B:Qh,B:10c,B:7d]

Nice hand D, Just for the record though, Suited gapped connectors is a total call, especially 3x at 5/10. You know I would've called u with that!!! lol Glad it worked out for ya though.

nh, standard play to reraise. You could flat call and pump the turn but really villian isn't getting away from toptop at this level.

dg1267 said:

Ugh, why? I guess maybe on the button, but what's the idea behind it? Just the hope of a flop like this one?

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I play almost as many hands as you at 6max, less lately. I don't understand, how are you voluntarily playing 30% of hands without playing suited one gap hands? Are you playing all ace rags instead, what else? I'd rather play 57s than A4o in a cash game.

D'wilius said:

I play almost as many hands as you at 6max, less lately. I don't understand, how are you voluntarily playing 30% of hands without playing suited one gap hands? Are you playing all ace rags instead, what else? I'd rather play 57s than A4o in a cash game.

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I'm wondering the same thing.

I really don't play that many A rag hands. I'm trying to make a video, and that will probably explain a lot. But I'm using Cam Studio instead of Camtasia and the final product for a 20 minute video was almost 2Gb!

Now I do play A8/A9 probably a lot more than I should, but that in itself wouldn't make up for 8-10%. Idk, I'll have to d/l the Camtasia trial and make a vid, I guess.

I know you posted the final HH, but I'd still like to give my thoughts.

I like to reraise there, or check / call and turn shove.......either way it's +EV.

Most people dont realize how much of a PITA AQ is to play. Especially on a board like that when facing an initial raisers re barreling........

Just for my understanding - I open suited one gappers, but I rarely, if ever, call a raise with them, even IP - is this a leak?

slycbnew said:

Just for my understanding - I open suited one gappers, but I rarely, if ever, call a raise with them, even IP - is this a leak?

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Against ABC tags, not calling in position with 75s is a leak. Against spewy/bluffy LAGs, calling a raise with 75s is spew.

c9h13no3 said:

Against ABC tags, not calling in position with 75s is a leak. Against spewy/bluffy LAGs, calling a raise with 75s is spew.

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Thanks for summing that up, C9. I need to start playing more suited one-gappers I guess.

i like the reraise inducing the allin, nice play imo, unfortunately i got caught on the wrong end of this exact hand last night , but yea well played, and as i can attest to, its very hard to get away with AQ in that situation especially against a LAG.

i like the way u played this hand.
i honestly had him on AQ from the start.
at this level top pair on board with A kicker gives lots of action.
nice hand , nice pot, well played imo

dg1267 said:

Two pr did go through my mind, but the only one that I could even consider was 75s. Who calls with that crap though?

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I do just for situations like this. Someone hits with overpair or even TPTK and you got decent chance to take their stack. Even better to hit straight while someone gets set. As long as effective stacks are 100bb or more preferably with another caller unless raiser is spewy post flop.

Why shove?

The board is relatively draw free.. there is a possible straight draw.. but its unlikely.

Shoving here is pointless.

If you are against a set, the set will call.. you loose.

If you are against something like AQ, KQ etc then there are relatively few outs.. an ace but thats it.

Call here and build a pot.

You are in a way ahead/way behind situation.

Call to build a pot and hope that an ace doesn't appear. If it does you pretty much have to give up.. but if it doesn't then you are likely to be ahead.

Shove and you win the pot now or loose to a bigger hand.

Remember the whole small hand small pot.

Call here, look to check the turn and then your opponent may see weakness and bet the river with a lower pair.

Shoving here is pointless IMO

EDIT: Just scrolled down further and saw how the hand played out.. I'm happy with my analysis!!! Yet very surprised that the villian called in this situation

Stu_Ungar said:

Yet very surprised that the villian called in this situation

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I see TPGK/TPTK badly overvalued in micros - I'm not at all surprised villain called...