$10 NLHE 6-max: jj on a two toned flop vs agression

rssurfer54

rssurfer54

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Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 11/5/1

PokerStars - $0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG: $10.00
CO: $10.42
Hero (BTN): $11.17
SB: $10.27
BB: $10.00

SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero has J:heart: J:diamond:

fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, BB calls $0.30

Flop: ($0.85, 2 players) 4:spade: 7:spade: T:heart:
BB checks, Hero bets $0.50, BB raises to $1.75, Hero calls $1.25

Turn: ($4.35, 2 players) 2:club:
BB bets $2.10, Hero raises to $9.02 and is all-in, BB calls $5.75 and is all-in

Villain is tight over 36 hands, but had already seen him bluff-shove the river with a high after missing the nut flush draw.

Should I have raised or folded the flop? and the shove on the turn is....(good,bad, terrible)?
 
C

ComplexPlaya

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I was going to say to fold the flop since he's such a nit, but you know there are bluffs in his range so he is not all passive.

It's a tough situation, I would not raise the turn though, I doubt he has a FD best you can hope for is AT.

I guess it's still a fold because his range is so narrow, mainly sets overpairs and AT, and you're getting crushed by it. If he had alot of draws in his range maybe, but he plays few hands plus the c/r donk turn line is one of a set not FD imo.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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If you're not folding, this is the way I play it.
 
ChuckTs

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Yeah, agreed with c9.

I don't think I'm folding either - villain's stats are somewhat insignificant over <40 hands, and given how wet the flop is, he can have tons of draws himself, and also be valuebetting lighter (ie worse than JJ). His value range (that beats JJ) is really narrow, too - basically only sets. QQ+ usually 3bets pf, and there are very few, if any combos of two pair.
 
forsakenone

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what, 40 hands not enough to decide he is a nit? dude has you beat, at least try and see a cheap showdow, thats what i would do, call the turn bet, and check the river and hope he goes for small value with the set of 7s.
 
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ComplexPlaya

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I love these threads, where one opinion says...do this, another no do the exact opposite, another no do what the 1st guy said, another....

OP's learn alot I bet :D
 
Stu_Ungar

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Why shove the turn?

villian is repping a set.

When you shove he folds all his bluffs and calls with all his sets.

If you think he is so manic that the flop raise just has to be a bluff then what does the shove accomplish?
 
rssurfer54

rssurfer54

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I love these threads, where one opinion says...do this, another no do the exact opposite, another no do what the 1st guy said, another....

OP's learn alot I bet :D

haha, the thought process is more important than any given hand, so i mean just seeing how other people think about it is helpful.
 
rssurfer54

rssurfer54

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Why shove the turn?

villian is repping a set.

When you shove he folds all his bluffs and calls with all his sets.

If you think he is so manic that the flop raise just has to be a bluff then what does the shove accomplish?

I see your point. so after the flop, do you think we call turn and fold to a river shove, or call call, or just fold the turn (or flop...)?
 
c9h13no3

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Why shove the turn?
Make draws pay the maximum. If we're calling the flop its because we think our opponent has a lot of semi-bluffing draws in his range, and we're taking a card off to improve our equity. When a blank rolls off, we shove, and he's usually pot committed with A♠Q♠, J♠T♠ or whatever. He won't barrel all these hands on the river, and we won't know what cards hit him. However, we will have to call a shove with many hands that he's pot committed to.

I think I'm with Chuck. I'm not folding an over pair button vs. blind with this small a sample, and his bet size on the turn isn't really showing a lot of strength. Sets are hard to make, and guys who rep sets button vs. blind with a small sample size don't get a lot of credit from me.
 
rssurfer54

rssurfer54

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he showed up with J♠T♠
thanks for helps guys!
javascript:popup_imp('/webmail/comp...ach McDermott <zmcdermo@student.umass.edu>');
 
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