$10 NLHE 6-max: Fold AA ok?

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yanivshe

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PokerStars - $0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 152.6 BB (VPIP: 20.13, PFR: 17.29, 3Bet Preflop: 4.55, hands: 940)
Hero (UTG): 134.6 BB
MP: 101.5 BB (VPIP: 30.10, PFR: 24.03, 3Bet Preflop: 6.58, Hands: 423)
CO: 73.6 BB
BTN: 106.3 BB (VPIP: 27.34, PFR: 22.77, 3Bet Preflop: 9.16, Hands: 1,568)
SB: 65.2 BB (VPIP: 19.70, PFR: 13.64, 3Bet Preflop: 5.66, Hands: 134)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, CO posts penalty blind 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has A:diamond: A:heart:

Hero raises to 4 BB, fold, CO calls 3 BB, BTN calls 4 BB, SB calls 3.5 BB, BB calls 3 BB

Flop: (20 BB, 5 players) T:heart: T:spade: 5:heart:
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets 12 BB, fold, BTN raises to 28 BB, fold, fold, fold

Hero mucks A:diamond: A:heart: (Two Pair, Aces and Tens)
BTN wins 42 BB
 
John A

John A

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I'd like to hear some opinions from 10nl players. It seems really strange that he'd want to raise with that many people in the pot if he had a monster hand like trips or better. I mean even versus you, him raising into that many people just looks so strong. My gut says at this level with those kinds of stats that he has some kind of mid pair and doesn't know how to play it. I mean he's in a great spot to call if he has a big hand in case someone shoves a draw, or just decides to come along with a draw or other mid pair. I don't think he'd be in a leveling situation, so it's either a) he doesn't know how to play a mid pair, or b) he's raising with trips or flush draw (to check the turn). I'd probably call and evaluate the turn, but if you don't think you have good info or a read, a fold isn't horrible at this level.
 
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RickAversion

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I'd have PFR raised to 6BB, not 4BB.
 
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yanivshe

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I'd like to hear some opinions from 10nl players. It seems really strange that he'd want to raise with that many people in the pot if he had a monster hand like trips or better. I mean even versus you, him raising into that many people just looks so strong. My gut says at this level with those kinds of stats that he has some kind of mid pair and doesn't know how to play it. I mean he's in a great spot to call if he has a big hand in case someone shoves a draw, or just decides to come along with a draw or other mid pair. I don't think he'd be in a leveling situation, so it's either a) he doesn't know how to play a mid pair, or b) he's raising with trips or flush draw (to check the turn). I'd probably call and evaluate the turn, but if you don't think you have good info or a read, a fold isn't horrible at this level.


well, he could easily have trips here and be afraid of the flush draw or maybe he thought I couldn't fold overpair .
 
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thatgreekdude

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I'd like to hear some opinions from 10nl players. It seems really strange that he'd want to raise with that many people in the pot if he had a monster hand like trips or better. I mean even versus you, him raising into that many people just looks so strong. My gut says at this level with those kinds of stats that he has some kind of mid pair and doesn't know how to play it. I mean he's in a great spot to call if he has a big hand in case someone shoves a draw, or just decides to come along with a draw or other mid pair. I don't think he'd be in a leveling situation, so it's either a) he doesn't know how to play a mid pair, or b) he's raising with trips or flush draw (to check the turn). I'd probably call and evaluate the turn, but if you don't think you have good info or a read, a fold isn't horrible at this level.

This is solid accurate information, i'm never just folding that flop and it's a good flop to try and check raise bluff at so we at least have to call the flop, it's unlikely that any thinking player is going to raise this flop with trips or a boat.
 
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swingro

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Actually you have 1500 hands on the guy. A shot of the flop tab from the HUD would be helpful. Not much but al least some general line he takes in some situations.
IMO in a 6 way pot it is not easy to reraise without a boat or at least J10. Anyone can slowplay a T here.
 
John A

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well, he could easily have trips here and be afraid of the flush draw or maybe he thought I couldn't fold overpair .

This could very well be how someone at 10nl would think about this spot. It's a horrible spot to raise though with this many people in. If that's what you think, then a fold is fine. I think most thinking players aren't raising here with trips though.

Also, your open raise sizing is fine.
 
akaRobbo

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Villain looks pretty crazy so I don't think im folding Aces here especially with backdoor nut flush. Id call and evaluate the turn.
 
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tomnovember

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PokerStars - $0.10 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BB: 152.6 BB (VPIP: 20.13, PFR: 17.29, 3Bet Preflop: 4.55, Hands: 940)
Hero (UTG): 134.6 BB
MP: 101.5 BB (VPIP: 30.10, PFR: 24.03, 3Bet Preflop: 6.58, Hands: 423)
CO: 73.6 BB
BTN: 106.3 BB (VPIP: 27.34, PFR: 22.77, 3Bet Preflop: 9.16, Hands: 1,568)
SB: 65.2 BB (VPIP: 19.70, PFR: 13.64, 3Bet Preflop: 5.66, Hands: 134)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, CO posts penalty blind 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has A<font color='red'>♦</font> A<font color='red'>♥</font>

Hero raises to 4 BB, fold, CO calls 3 BB, BTN calls 4 BB, SB calls 3.5 BB, BB calls 3 BB

Flop: (20 BB, 5 players) T<font color='red'>♥</font> T<font color='black'>♠</font> 5<font color='red'>♥</font>
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets 12 BB, fold, BTN raises to 28 BB, fold, fold, fold

Hero mucks A<font color='red'>♦</font> A<font color='red'>♥</font> (Two Pair, Aces and Tens)
BTN wins 42 BB

I may check raise the flop and bet half pot on the turn so that I can exactly know where I am.
 
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yanivshe

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I may check raise the flop and bet half pot on the turn so that I can exactly know where I am.

check raise flop + half pot the turn just to find out where i am..and then what?
I'm already committed in this situation
 
REALITYPOKER

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I think the fold is good IMO there are so many people in the hand there that anything is possible. Villian check raising with trips maybe weak kicker there scared and trying to protect against flush draw, which IMO is possible play from a 10nl player. Also by check raising he is bloating the pot trying to get it in by the river with trips, very possible. Good fold.....
 
weldphaser

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i guess you could go either way, but you need to go into your database. w 1.500 hands on this dude there had to be spots where he's raise post.

I'd call and evaluate turn, on tyhe fence though tbh, depending on villains history
 
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bnasp2

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I would say the villain could do this with both trips and overpair. Also as total bluff. So as mentioned by others, history on him could help a bit, does he bluff a lot? At least his VPIP could show if his range has more JT or more pocket pairs.

Fold is ok to unknown player I suppose. Its so multiway pot, that odds of trips are quite high.
 
suby_rafael

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Good fold but there was absolutely no need for a c-bet just for the sake of it. On the flop with five other players in the hand anyone can have a hand that beats two aces and the chances of it are very high. So i would simply give up on the flop itself and check fold. So you simply wasted 12bb with an unnecessary c-bet where you would have only lost 4bb if you had not made that c-bet.

Who knows if you had not bet, there is a small chance someone slow plays a 10 there and gives you a free card and if you get lucky and hit an ace, you stack that player.:D
 
Nathan Williams

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I think the fold is fine. Even though his raise seems bizarre on this board I think you are just leveling yourself by asking why anyone would raise here. They will at these stakes. With this many people in the pot and raising here it is a sign of massive strength at these stakes.
 
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tomnovember

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check raise flop + half pot the turn just to find out where i am..and then what?
I'm already committed in this situation

But not further committed. Or if you have planned to play hit or fold strategy against 4 opponents, just check call - check fold or even directly check - fold here.
 
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nidal55

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agree totally w blackrain plus bet even smaller on the flop for pot control making worse to call. second u can clickback make the smaller raise possible on the flop for info, but folding will be the best play most of the time. gl
 
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cahartattack

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Good fold but there was absolutely no need for a c-bet just for the sake of it. On the flop with five other players in the hand anyone can have a hand that beats two aces and the chances of it are very high. So i would simply give up on the flop itself and check fold. So you simply wasted 12bb with an unnecessary c-bet where you would have only lost 4bb if you had not made that c-bet.

Who knows if you had not bet, there is a small chance someone slow plays a 10 there and gives you a free card and if you get lucky and hit an ace, you stack that player.:D

This right here. If you had villain HU or maybe one other caller a C-Bet and fold is a little more ok to me because you have a better shot of making them fold. Flops like this seem to make everyone turn into check machines and can give you a free card to better evaluate a potential move on the turn.

I like the PF Raise and even though I say a multi-way pot with a flop like this should be a check I can't lie I would have a hard time not betting with aces if I get checked to as well.

The question in the end is if you call this raise are you willing to have to call most of if not all of your stack especially if a heart doesn't come? If yes then I would call here and push a heart/check a blank turn and call down to the river. (This is of course assuming your read tells you he doesn't have the 10 or 55) If no then fold, take whatever notes you can/tag the hand, and stash it away in the memory banks for later.
 
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