$10 NLHE 6-max: Bovada Zoom - any one know the though process of this player?

XXPXXP

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P1(SB) $6.83 - VP: PFR: AF: W: STL: 3B: CB: N:0
P2(BB) $16.99 - VP: PFR: AF: W: STL: 3B: CB: N:0
P3(UTG) $17.50 - VP: PFR: AF: W: STL: 3B: CB: N:0
P4(MP) $9.74 - VP: PFR: AF: W: STL: 3B: CB: N:0
P5(CO) $8.90 - VP: PFR: AF: W: STL: 3B: CB: N:0
Me(BTN) $5.15 - VP:100 PFR:100 AF:Inf. W:0| STL: 3B:100| CB:0| N:0.96 hands:2


Pre Flop: Me(BTN) with [Ad,Kh]
P3(UTG) raises 0.25, P4(MP) folds, P5(CO) folds, Me(BTN) raises 0.63, P1(SB) folds, P2(BB) folds, P3(UTG) calls 0.38


Flop: (8d,Js,Qs) (2 players)
P3(EP) checks, Me(BTN) checks


Turn: 9c (2 players)
P3(EP) checks, Me(BTN) checks


River: Tc (2 players)
P3(EP) checks, Me(BTN) bets 0.63


Final:
P3(UTG) shows [Jc,Jh]
Returns 0.63 to Me(BTN)
Me(BTN) wins 1.34
_____________________

My question:

what is the thought process of this player? or kind of player? - any one have the similar experience before and willing to share some idea.
play JJ like this?
and fold on river?:confused::confused::confused:
many thanks
 
Figaroo2

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As it's a 3bet pot he was probably expecting you to bet the flop and was looking to check raise. After the turn card brings 4 to a straight perhaps he's just happy to check call. When the straight arrives and you bet he probably realises you had AK which is why you checked flop and turn. He actually made a good fold on the end.
You are right it's an odd hand but explainable if he was looking to CR.
 
IPlay

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As it's a 3bet pot he was probably expecting you to bet the flop and was looking to check raise. After the turn card brings 4 to a straight perhaps he's just happy to check call. When the straight arrives and you bet he probably realises you had AK which is why you checked flop and turn. He actually made a good fold on the end.
You are right it's an odd hand but explainable if he was looking to CR.

Exactly this, you made a good check back on flop and it was just a TERRIBLE run out for his hand and he played it pretty perfect actually.
 
Aces2w1n

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Make sure you have 100bb before playing a hand. Your always going to put yourself in awkward spots

The guy with jj couldnt do much else. If with jj betting the turn would that b an error??
 
XXPXXP

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Exactly this, you made a good check back on flop and it was just a TERRIBLE run out for his hand and he played it pretty perfect actually.

flop 99% leading for value.
I did not see any reason not to betting this flop.
waiting for what hand? - besides this is 3bet pot, flop pot is bigger than single raised opn pot, and effective 50BB, it is easy to grow pot, and win as much as possible.
river folding ...I don't know, but I think he played this hand too weak, not only missed some value but also river I would think at least make a call with JJ.
 
IPlay

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flop 99% leading for value.
I did not see any reason not to betting this flop.
waiting for what hand? - besides this is 3bet pot, flop pot is bigger than single raised opn pot, and effective 50BB, it is easy to grow pot, and win as much as possible.
river folding ...I don't know, but I think he played this hand too weak, not only missed some value but also river I would think at least make a call with JJ.

Donking this flop with JJ is bad, check raise is much better because it induces bluffs from AK cbets and makes it easier to get it in against KK and AA before scare cards come.
 
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Donking this flop with JJ is bad, check raise is much better because it induces bluffs from AK cbets and makes it easier to get it in against KK and AA before scare cards come.

i put the balance situation in PC.
AK definitely is not putting a bet here.
JJ's max equity shows donk here. the value of donk and check , donk is about 0.46BB extra.
 
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Turn not the flop

I might think JJ at least should leading on the turn.
there is still a lot value range JJ could have.

JJ's Value range VS JJ's behind range >1
beside, I don't think there are a lot 10X in button's 3bet range.

even the board is scary but I still think standing on JJ's shoes, JJ should put a bet on turns.

PS: regarding to starting chips 100BB, I seldom do default 100BB, my stack usually is based on players at the table, from could be from 30BB - 45BB -60BB -70BB-100BB. because I would pick up the best stack strategy [SSS, MSS, BSS]on the table.:D
 
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WVHillbilly

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PS: regarding to starting chips 100BB, I seldom do default 100BB, my stack usually is based on players at the table, from could be from 30BB - 45BB -60BB -70BB-100BB. because I would pick up the best stack strategy [SSS, MSS, BSS]on the table.:D

Bad idea, but regardless this is Zoom so you don't get to choose the stack sizes you're playing against from hand to hand. Big mistake to be anything but full stacked.
 
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Bad idea, but regardless this is Zoom so you don't get to choose the stack sizes you're playing against from hand to hand. Big mistake to be anything but full stacked.

see the variance
Capture2
Capture3
Capture4

If you could keep the same winning rate but less variance.
Starting with short stack called mistake?/Bad idea?
Mathematically, Everyone loves high profit with less variance.


 
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WVHillbilly

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But you can't keep the same winrate. By definition playing short, limits your winrate. Sorry man, you're just doing it wrong.
 
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But you can't keep the same winrate. By definition playing short, limits your winrate. Sorry man, you're just doing it wrong.

Who told you bring short stack limites win rate?

The only thing limite winning rate is play with good player with no edge.
not how many chips you bring to the table.

if you don't have an edge, bring 100K BB chips means nothing.
the other thing is
bring 100BB does not mean you winning rate will be 3 time more than brink 33BB
100BB has BSS, while 33BB have to play SSS

it is player who can use these strategy well to win.
BTW: if you bring Shortstack play SSS VS Big stack like buying 100, if BSS still play his style, by 100% BSS 100BB lost huge money.
it is called mistake, in order to play for win BSS needs to play same SSS VS Shortstack.
 
WVHillbilly

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And playing short limits your edge. Bad players can't make as big of mistakes. It's just not possible because your stack size is limiting how much money they can drop to you on any given hand. Keep trying though.
 
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And playing short limits your edge. Bad players can't make as big of mistakes. It's just not possible because your stack size is limiting how much money they can drop to you on any given hand. Keep trying though.

really?
looks like I have heard , even the best player like phil Ivey/Stu ungar[if he is alive] could not beat 10BB shortstack cash table, regardless phil Ivey/Stu ungar buying 100K BB or more? if Everyone play optimized.:D

Besize it is not stake size limited the win. it is your net win counts here.
100BB most of the time need to buy implied odds.
but... the net win part is most of the same. the only thing works here is edge, or right strategy. not default buyin stack.
 
WVHillbilly

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If everyone at a table is a PoS short-stacker having a 1000bb stack is meaningless, everyone is playing with 10bb effective. And with a 10bb effective stack size NO ONE but the house wins. Absolutely everyone at that table loses to the rake long term.

Play however you want but your 100% wrong about effective stack size and winrate assuming you're equally skilled with all stack sizes (which you seem to claim that you are earlier).
 
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If everyone at a table is a PoS short-stacker having a 1000bb stack is meaningless, everyone is playing with 10bb effective. And with a 10bb effective stack size NO ONE but the house wins. Absolutely everyone at that table loses to the rake long term.

Play however you want but your 100% wrong about effective stack size and winrate assuming you're equally skilled with all stack sizes (which you seem to claim that you are earlier).

I am not wrong about effective stack size.
I am talking about default buyin 100BB, like you said.
most of the chance, it means nothing to auto pilot buyin 100BB.
Every cash table, I choose and pick have an edge , and I have collected data to choose what is the best buyin stack on that table.
:D

sometimes you have skill to win does not mean you have skill to win when buyin 100BB effective stack:D
 
WVHillbilly

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This hand is at ZOOM. You don't pick your table at ZOOM. You're just trying to justify not topping up for some reason and it's bullshit!
 
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This hand is at ZOOM. You don't pick your table at ZOOM. You're just trying to justify not topping up for some reason and it's bullshit!

I am in the zoom to bring min buyin because
if some bullshit Big stack play trash BSS
I am playing MSS, I am default win.
 
IPlay

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I am in the zoom to bring min buyin because
if some bullshit Big stack play trash BSS
I am playing MSS, I am default win.

So you are not playing to win but playing to limit your loses? That fine for a rec player but you will not find one winning reg out there that plays with this mindset.
 
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So you are not playing to win but playing to limit your loses? That fine for a rec player but you will not find one winning reg out there that plays with this mindset.

I play for max edge.
and I have data support.
don't think other player keep the different idea have the data support. - or the article writer have, if he have post it. or you have post it to support your ideas. :D
And I do think this kind of strategy gives me MAX win.

that's it.

PS: I don't need a mind set, all I need is to analysis my at least 400K hands history.:D

BTW: logically, if you win 15bb/100 with 50BB default buyin, but who guarantee you win 30BB/100 when brings in 100BB default buyin?
the other thing is , if you win 15BB/100 buyin but 100BB default buyin , only win 15BB does that mean you need to buy extra 50BB more not open one more table for winning rate?

I don't know what is the mind set of default buyin, but I use maths and computer to calculate before, and it is a little complicated.

the conclusion is at least 60% times, not buyin 100BB give you max profit, max BB/100 hands, but less variance.
so why are you going to buy 100BB default every time.

you target is max Winning rate/100 hands - meaning efficiency not. max pot you win.:D I think this is correct.
 
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