$10 NLHE 6-max: Bottom set on flop - fold to 2 shoves?

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roddy1977

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poker stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - http://www.handconverter.com/hands/2981667
The DeucesCracked.com Hand History Converter

BTN: $10.05 (VP 15, PF 10, 62 hands)
SB: $16.72
BB: $9.10
UTG: $16.33
MP: $28.70 (VP 13, PF 0, 8 hands)
Hero (CO): $17.21

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is CO with 4d 4c
1 fold, MP raises to $0.26, Hero calls $0.26, BTN calls $0.26, 1 fold, BB calls $0.16

Flop: ($1.09) Jc 4h Tc (4 players)
BB checks, MP bets $1.04, Hero raises to $2.60, BTN raises to $9.79 all in, BB folds, MP raises to $28.44 all in, Hero ?

Obviously worried that either MP or BTN could have JJ or TT - should I fold bottom set here?
 
B

benspocket

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well dont think i would of folded becouse of 2 raises/shoves
 
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Snakester420

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They only beat u with JJ and TT and people like to shove with straight draws or flush draws, both of which are possible. Also people may shove and get in JT with top 2 pair. If you're beat you're beat, 2 hands beat you and not many combos of them.
 
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theresets

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Don't think this is a fold. Lots of straight and flush draws could be jamming. Also there are worst two pairs. There are only 6 combos of hands that beat you, 9 combos of two pairs you have in bad shape, and lots of straights and flush draws you are ahead of. Seems like a call to me
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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the deeper u get the more folds like this you will need to make.
 
J

joe777

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If this 2nl I won't be hesitate to call because most of them at 2nl are playing loose and predictables at times.Besides we are facing raises from multiple players,and both of you and MP are deepstack so I am leaning toward folding here.Even an open ended straight and flush draw have close to 50% equity.
 
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roddy1977

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Thanks for the opinions, guys! I folded in the end, a tight fold but my reasoning was as you suggest, joe777 - '...we are facing raises from multiple players,and both of you and MP are deepstack so I am leaning toward folding here.Even an open ended straight and flush draw have close to 50% equity.'

Typically, in this instance, I would've been a 76% favourite if I had called, as the BTN had JT, and MP had KK, and neither improved! Aargh!
 
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braveslice

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100 bb deep this is obvious call, however this deep it might be even fold, not that I could ever do it because board is so draw heavy.

Against nut range {JJ-TT,JTs,AcKc,AcQc,KcQc} you have 20%, MP is asking 32%, but just noticed that side pot changes this heavily vs. one opponent you have 40% equity. So it should give you equity around 28%, which is quite good
 
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A

arod6893

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Instant call.

Had a situation today on ACR when I flopped bottom set and faced shove/shove. One person had AJ (top pair and a flush draw) , other 99, my set held up.

Always take the set against two players that are drawing. Also ask yourself, is TT or JJ not 3-betting pre flop given how many BB you guys were? Much more common for those hands to be 3-bet that deep stacked versus flatted, since you never want to be in a hand 3-4 handed with JJ or TT both hands play terribly.

One player looked like AX of clubs and another with KK with the K of clubs or at worst KQ of clubs (for either of them). Two pair would have been a possibility in my head, but to be honest that is too aggressive of a shove versus the ranges of what you and the other player would have had. But even if, Too many times you're ahead of both and both players are donk shoving with what they perceive as a strong draw when in reality the STRF isnt hitting often and even if their hands hit you still have plenty of equity into the river with a set.

Good Luck!
 
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