$10 NLHE 6-max: AKo in BB vs OR and 3bet

fletchdad

fletchdad

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Open raise from Taggy reg who does not get out of line, not much info on 3 bettor cept he is agro when he gets involved.

Poker Stars $10.00 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players - View hand 1780542
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

SB: $19.30 - VPIP: 58, PFR: 14, 3B: 0, AF: 3.2, Hands: 571
Hero (BB): $10.00 - VPIP: 18, PFR: 13, 3B: 4, AF: 2.2, Hands: 269392
UTG: $10.00 - VPIP: 27, PFR: 25, 3B: 7, AF: Infinity, Hands: 44
CO: $12.10 - VPIP: 20, PFR: 17, 3B: 4, AF: 2.9, Hands: 1206
BTN: $12.17 - VPIP: 14, PFR: 14, 3B: 8, AF: Infinity, Hands: 44

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with A :diamond: K :heart:
1 fold, CO raises to $0.30, BTN raises to $0.90, Hero??
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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4-bet! You have sooooo much sexy fold equity here! And we're obviously calling a shove.

I really love cold 4-bet bluffs, and I'd prolly 4-bet with quite a few bluffs here as well. So AK is near the top of my range for 4-betting here.
 
forsakenone

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this is a thought one. cause you know you are beat when you 4bet here and you face a shove, but calling is even worst so it is a though spot for you.

I know how to play this with the image I have, but with your image I would tend to 4bet fold to a shove because nobody shoves worst than AK in someone playing 18/13 but you could get some decent hands to fold, like QQ or JJ or AK.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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4-bet/folding AK is so, so very bad.
 
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rw11687

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4-bet/folding AK is so, so very bad.

Normally I would agree, but I think there is an argument for doing this.

If we four bet and the original raiser shoves, do you really think were in a good spot? He's TAG and doesn't get out of line, so you can basically limit his range to AA, KK, QQ, AK if he shoves. Were 50/50 in 2 spots, and dominated in 2 spots. Not exactly a good place to be in. In this spot, I would cut my loses.
 
forsakenone

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c9 has not taken in the account that op is a nit.
 
acky100

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I dont know why you would ever 4bet here and plan to fold :/
 
John A

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You need to ask yourself, do you feel comfortable playing the hand out of position? When I don't against a specific opponent, and/or I don't have good info or stats I'd rather "solve" the hand pre-flop by 4-betting. This way I'm not guessing a lot out of position against possibly 2 opponents.
 
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You need to ask yourself, do you feel comfortable playing the hand out of position? When I don't against a specific opponent, and/or I don't have good info or stats I'd rather "solve" the hand pre-flop by 4-betting. This way I'm not guessing a lot out of position against possibly 2 opponents.

Agreed. But are you calling a shove by either opponent? Dont see how anyone can feel AK will be in a good spot facing a shove after 4 betting.
 
acky100

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We don't have to feel great about it, we get plenty of folds and by the time we've 4bet and get shoved on we will be priced in against his range anyways so folding would be a mistake.
 
duggs

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4-bet! You have sooooo much sexy fold equity here! And we're obviously calling a shove.

I really love cold 4-bet bluffs, and I'd prolly 4-bet with quite a few bluffs here as well. So AK is near the top of my range for 4-betting here.

cold 4bets are great, what hands do you use to 4bet/bluff? Ax Kx?
 
acky100

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cold 4bets are great, what hands do you use to 4bet/bluff? Ax Kx?

Yeah if you can they will have a higher % success rate, although cold 4bet bluff opportunities are pretty rare so sometimes we cant just wait to choose the best hands to do it with unlike when we are bluff 3 betting late position opens in the blinds. But stuff like AT,AJ, KT, etc - hands that aren't good enough to call are gonna be pretty good candidates!
 
c9h13no3

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Having the right hand isn't nearly as important as doing it in the right situation. Concentrate more on doing it when your image is good, and the two raisers in front of you are likely to be FOS.
 
fletchdad

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Size of the 4B? I cant 4B/ fold vs 1 guy, if I plan on that I should fold now, so I will 4B call - except in the case of me=4B, CO= shove BTN= call, then I am out of here. (Sound ok?, IMO I am WB>flipping if this happens so no need to call)

2.10-2.50 ish? Or more 2.50-2.90ish??
 
forsakenone

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2.50 fold to shove and save 7.5$.
 
Ducky7

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2.50 fold to shove and save 7.5$.

What if the OP or BTN player is shoving hands like AQs, 99 TT then we are meant to be calling off, in this spot they have AA and KK too few times and you will pick up the pot with the 4 bet so often, without a specific read its hard to fold AK in this spot, especially if your opponents could think you were 4-betting light
 
acky100

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If theyre shoving hands like that its a no brainer, but they wont be really. Even if theyre only shoving KK+ AK we're pretty much priced in and i think people are shoving wider than that, its 10nl people do stupid shit.
 
Ducky7

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Ye well thats what i was meaning they are gna shove a wierd range but i was giving examples ha
 
forsakenone

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if they are that kind of guys that shove 99, TT AQs you should call, but given the info we have on all players, including the hero, the right move is to 4bet fold.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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if they are that kind of guys that shove 99, TT AQs you should call, but given the info we have on all players, including the hero, the right move is to 4bet fold.

What info is this? Do you know his 5-bet shoving range?
 
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If he is really a tight player and like to 3bet, 4bet/ fold to shove is acceptable for me.
Like I said I used to be very spew in this situation with JJ QQ. Usually it turns out bad to me.Too many action pre vs a tight player (even a loose one who also does rarely shove pre) is a tough spot
 
Cafeman

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Even if theyre only shoving KK+ AK we're pretty much priced in and i think people are shoving wider than that, its 10nl people do stupid shit.
This. 4betting and looking to get it in pre can't be a big mistake here.
 
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