$10 NLHE 6-max: 76s on But, 3B by SB

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 29/22/2.5

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/2ql0PoZ

Oh boy I got kinda an embarrassing one today. Preflop felt standard. Don't think there is a question to just call here, 4 betting seems sub-optimal folding seems to weak and tigght etc etc...

Flop: V C-bets his range is uncapped though I know a SB 3B range is going to be rather wide (Especially vs. button here). And I feel okay calling here. That could be to loose? Especially to that sizing?
My thoughts on it, with my gutshot to the nuts and backdoor heart equity and being in position I feel as though floating here is okay knowing that players can get out of line here and just range bet and try and take it down.

Turn: He checks, I then bet. Now I am kinda split between this decision and this is where thinking down multiple streets is important. First I'll discuss the other option that I didn't do.
I think checking back taking the free card is okay, though unless I hit my gutter I have no showdown and am expecting to lose. so essentially in my mind that is a give up, though I guess you could bluff river but it seems less believable? Maybe I'm wrong here but thoughts would be awesome.
I like betting turn but I think I needed to prep to bluff river if I didn't hit and a good bluff card came.

River : Boom an awesome card to bluff I think?? At the same time it gives me a marginal hand, which I thought, hey marginal hand. Maybe he has some Ace highs etc.. and I win. Which now thinking about it the line and his betting makes no sense regarding it, possibly the only hand that would take that line is like A4 of Hearts.

I understand that he does get the flush there on occasion but I think my massive blunder was not bluffing all in this river looking to get 9's and PP below TP to fold here. I also am having some results oriented thinking regarding this some I know for a fact hence why I would love the opinions of others on this hand.

I can admit I am a bit trigger shy at times and felt if I was prepped to bluff this river my line was correct. If I don't bluff here I feel it was a massive blunder. But I could be wrong all around here , would love some thoughts , thanks

I dont think, you did anything particularly wrong in this hand. I would probably raise the flop though, since you really have no showdown value, and he should have a lot of A high etc, which will C-bet and then fold to a raise. Of course I would rather have an OESD than just a gutshot, but its still the same semi-bluffing idea. I am less keen on betting the turn, because that card often helped him, so now you might be trying to get him off top pair. Checking back river is fine, I think.

I agree that raising flop seems better. Factoring in that any AKQ he likely barrels and/or improves will make it a lot of ugly turn decisions.

As played - I think rangebased river decision was fine

Minikiwi9 said:

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 29/22/2.5

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/2ql0PoZ

Oh boy I got kinda an embarrassing one today. Preflop felt standard. Don't think there is a question to just call here, 4 betting seems sub-optimal folding seems to weak and tigght etc etc...

Flop: V C-bets his range is uncapped though I know a SB 3B range is going to be rather wide (Especially vs. button here). And I feel okay calling here. That could be to loose? Especially to that sizing?
My thoughts on it, with my gutshot to the nuts and backdoor heart equity and being in position I feel as though floating here is okay knowing that players can get out of line here and just range bet and try and take it down.

Turn: He checks, I then bet. Now I am kinda split between this decision and this is where thinking down multiple streets is important. First I'll discuss the other option that I didn't do.
I think checking back taking the free card is okay, though unless I hit my gutter I have no showdown and am expecting to lose. so essentially in my mind that is a give up, though I guess you could bluff river but it seems less believable? Maybe I'm wrong here but thoughts would be awesome.
I like betting turn but I think I needed to prep to bluff river if I didn't hit and a good bluff card came.

River : Boom an awesome card to bluff I think?? At the same time it gives me a marginal hand, which I thought, hey marginal hand. Maybe he has some Ace highs etc.. and I win. Which now thinking about it the line and his betting makes no sense regarding it, possibly the only hand that would take that line is like A4 of Hearts.

I understand that he does get the flush there on occasion but I think my massive blunder was not bluffing all in this river looking to get 9's and PP below TP to fold here. I also am having some results oriented thinking regarding this some I know for a fact hence why I would love the opinions of others on this hand.

I can admit I am a bit trigger shy at times and felt if I was prepped to bluff this river my line was correct. If I don't bluff here I feel it was a massive blunder. But I could be wrong all around here , would love some thoughts , thanks

Click to expand...

Thank U 4 Posting

OK wow what a case of morning brain I had. I typed out a great but completely wrong response to this already.

So V 3 bets from SB. We call.
Vs standard 10NL players we have to make a hand as they call to much.
We float flop ok. Is this the type of V we can float?
Do we know this V will fold 88 or the J9 they had?
If we under bet bluff turn it should always be a 2 barrel bluff.
We would be targeting 88 77 67 all 9's.
The issue becomes does this V call to much. Does this V think you have AK AJ and are just using the Q as a bluff card. Is that why this V checked to get to showdown?
Does your player pool fold to 1 over card?
Does this V expect you to pot value on the river?
How often are pot and pot+ value bets happening in your player pool? How often are they getting called?

On the river you check back because you are beating Ax hands but would Ax check turn? What 3 bet range did you give V that should be checking the turn vs you an aggressive player. Unless V has HUD stats that say you do not bet that river often enough. Do you know what your bet river stats are?

When V's take aggressive actions like 3 betting from SB it is fine to call in POS but we want to make a strong hand to continue in a player pool who's default is to call especially when we are a known AGG.


Hope this helps

turn bet is too small. I'd consider his 3b % from SB,prev hands & WTSD & consider bluffing river
He can have some Qx es here which I don't see folding a lot that is the problem but that's a very small part of his range, but you don't rep much as well so assuming you have a decent image at the table you can pull it off

Minikiwi9 said:

Villian Stats (VPIP/PFR/AF): 29/22/2.5

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/2ql0PoZ

Oh boy I got kinda an embarrassing one today. Preflop felt standard. Don't think there is a question to just call here, 4 betting seems sub-optimal folding seems to weak and tigght etc etc...

Flop: V C-bets his range is uncapped though I know a SB 3B range is going to be rather wide (Especially vs. button here). And I feel okay calling here. That could be to loose? Especially to that sizing?
My thoughts on it, with my gutshot to the nuts and backdoor heart equity and being in position I feel as though floating here is okay knowing that players can get out of line here and just range bet and try and take it down.

Turn: He checks, I then bet. Now I am kinda split between this decision and this is where thinking down multiple streets is important. First I'll discuss the other option that I didn't do.
I think checking back taking the free card is okay, though unless I hit my gutter I have no showdown and am expecting to lose. so essentially in my mind that is a give up, though I guess you could bluff river but it seems less believable? Maybe I'm wrong here but thoughts would be awesome.
I like betting turn but I think I needed to prep to bluff river if I didn't hit and a good bluff card came.

River : Boom an awesome card to bluff I think?? At the same time it gives me a marginal hand, which I thought, hey marginal hand. Maybe he has some Ace highs etc.. and I win. Which now thinking about it the line and his betting makes no sense regarding it, possibly the only hand that would take that line is like A4 of Hearts.

I understand that he does get the flush there on occasion but I think my massive blunder was not bluffing all in this river looking to get 9's and PP below TP to fold here. I also am having some results oriented thinking regarding this some I know for a fact hence why I would love the opinions of others on this hand.

I can admit I am a bit trigger shy at times and felt if I was prepped to bluff this river my line was correct. If I don't bluff here I feel it was a massive blunder. But I could be wrong all around here , would love some thoughts , thanks

Click to expand...

Hello there Minikiwi9, thank you very much for posting your hand.
You Villain seems the famous Aggro Donkey, so I see no problem in flatting 3-bet here in position, given that you are aware that SB is 3-betting too much here.
On the other hand, we can and should put up some 4-bet bluffs here with unimaginable hands such as 76s. If there is a good time for leveling preflop with light 4-bets, I can't find a better situation than versus an aggro donkey.
This sizing is not optimal for calling, so I would either fold here or 4-bet. IF SB 3-bets until 3x, it is an easy call because we are deep stacked and have good implied odds in position and a hand that has decent flobability.
Against 3.4x 3-bet I don't feel so secure, since the postflop the pot will be bigger than normal.

The Flop:

Beforing looking to your hole cards and the flop, try to consider:

A) How much % equity do we have on flops like this?
B) Which sizing was utilized for Villain to C-Bet Flop?

We see that our equity here sucks, because now if SB has for example, 9x, 4x or 3x, SB is really beating us. Okay that we have a gutshot and back door flush but for which price we are going chase it?
SB bets way too large, it bets $ 1.10 for a pot flop of $ 1.80, what is it 2/3 pot? This is not a good sizing for raising either for value or for bluff, neither for calling "to see" if perhaps we hit our gutter or we do complicated our lives even more when it comes a hearts.
I love raising here when we do have a gutshot+flush draw, because the equity is way too better. However, giving this price I think we should only be raising here with our sets and two pairs, and even so with care.
If you have folded preflop you would have saved 6 blinds.
If you have folded flop you would have saved more 11 blinds. 6 + 11 = 17 blinds that you already invested in a very strange scenario.

The Turn

Villain checks and you literally burn more 18 blinds for what? Villain is an aggro donkey, it is uncapable of folding 9x, 4x, 3x, it is never folding anything here, specially because you made a very, very fair price: you bet less than 1/2 pot, and I wonder which hands on your range are calling 3-bet in position, calling 2/3 pot flop and betting less than 1/2 pot turn when it comes a Qx?
We do not have sets or two pair a lot here. We do not have any significant Qx, such as AQ or KQ, we never have QQ, so, given that SB 3-bets preflop, SB will have all the QQ on its range and you will have none, so it doesn't make much sense to value bet our sets and two pair here, the same goes for our weak bluffs such as a single gutter now.

The River completes a flush

The river completes a flush, and it is kindda weird but now your 6 pair gives you no showdown value. You have no options here, but ever since you decided to bet river, you could now have the flush draws of diamonds. There are $ 7.60 on the table and Villain has $ 7.89 ES:
This is why I don't like to play fancy combos, even in position, versus any kind of players, no matter if aggro donkeys or whales: since you decided to bet turn, and the pot is already too strong, you should go for all-in here. It sucks because you are not blocking anything important, it sucks because Vilain can call you with any Qx here or two pair types but it sucks even more to have invested 35 blinds for nothing on a River like this.
There is no shame on folding flop versus stupid idiots, with all due respect to the SB player. Try to find on your mind some 4-bet bluffs in position versus this kind of player and 76s will not play very bad when called and if SB Aggro Donkey 5-bet shoves we leave it and keep our range balanced as always.
You gave too much information of your hand when you bet the turn so small.

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa