Women in Poker and how men play differently against us

Thought this was a very interesting and true blog. I know there are quite a few women players on this forum, so I thought it would apply to a lot of us.

I realize that some guys don't mean to, and other guys do, but I notice that men play differently against me--especially in live play--than against another man. They seem to be a lot more agressive and want to beat me more. I don't know if I give a weak vibe, or I guys just want the satisfaciton of beating a woman, but they always seem to push, push, push against me. It's as if they have less respect for my poker abilities because I'm a woman and they're men; I try to use this to my advantage, but I'm just wondering why this is the case? Anyways, here's the blog that isn't exactly what I was talking about, but also is pretty interesting observation.

WOMEN IN POKER-submitted by AceKickerCA

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This is the 21st Century and women still have to deal with name calling and abuse from men at online poker sites. It is “JUST NOT POKER!”

Now before all you men decide “Oh gee another man-bashing blog,” I have to tell you it is not. Nor am I tarring all men with the same brush. On average, most men treat the womaen with respect, however there are the ones that do not.

Women play in the same tournaments men do (i.e. wsop, WPT, etc.), and I have never seen a male player treat a woman the way some men treat a woman online. I am yet to see a professional male player disrespect a woman player on TV at all.

The number of women playing poker grows every year. Jennifer Harman, Evelyn Ng, Clonie Gowen and Annie Duke are just a few that have played the game well and played it against the men. When you watch them on TV and they win a hand, do the guys call them names? Threaten them? I think not.

Annie Duke is a force to be reckoned with when it comes to tournament poker. She regularly proves that women can hold their own in a game that is "male-oriented." Phil Helmuth once said that “Annie is the best all-around woman poker player in the world today.” How about that for a compliment? Notice, he is not abusing her for being good, he is praising her. She rarely plays in Ladies Only events because she says "Poker is one of the only sports where a woman can compete on a totally equal level with a man." She is the leading female money winner in WSOP history, and she took tenth place in the $10,000 main event when she was eight months pregnant. She then went on to win her 1st WSOP bracelet in 2004 playing in the $2000 Omaha High Low event. Annie is just one example of women being every bit as good as men when it comes to playing poker. I could list more accomplishments from women, but I think you see my point.


Yet online it is a different story, even in “Play Money” where losing does not mean anything. There is abuse and name calling when a woman wins a hand or takes the chip lead from a man. Below are a few examples of what goes on sometimes before play begins, and after losing a hand.

1. Sexual innuendo usually regarding the avatar being used, especially the sexier ones. If a woman says “Good Luck,” I have seen “Nice Rack” as the reply. Another common one is “Suck me before you suck out”. Those are just a few, but there are many more.

2. Name calling like "Slut," "Ho," and "Bitch;" which are tame to some of the vile and vulgar language I have heard, or rather seen, typed. All because a woman won a big hand and took the chip lead away from a man.

3. Threats of death, rape, and even as low as abducting and murdering a child. I realize it is online and no one knows where we live, but all the same. Those threats are uncalled for and very unsettling.


We do not deserve the abuse and we do not want it. None of it is necessary, and it needs to stop. We may not be famous like the female poker pros, but we deserve the same respect you would give them. Yes, even when we win a hand and take your chips. If a guy does, it you say “nh." That is all we want too. Let us all try and fix this problem because online poker would be much nicer for everyone if we did.

Oh also, someone posted this comment where this blog was posted. Anyone know if there is any truth to this. If there is, go Kathy, and great for Howard for sticking up for her.

Comment posted by wachinpntdry "I was observing a gsme in Mississippi one day. The table had Howard Lederer and Kathy Lieberman along with some amateurs. Kathy won a rather large pot fromHoward. He told her what a great job she did and congratulatred her. All of a sudden one of the others started getting mouthy and abusive with Kathy. He balled her the "B" word and Howard told him he was treading where he didn't belong. The mouthy guy stood up and punched Howard and told Kathy she was next. Evidentilly this moron did not know Kathy is a black belt. When he attacked her, she turned him everyway but loose. The man was arrested and the game was rescheduled. That just proves that abuse has its consequences. Go Kathy. I am a real Annie Duke fan. I don't think she is just one of the best women players, I think she is one of the best players."

Poker requires no physical strength, and there is no reason why a woman cannot be equally as effective as a man.

This is self-evident. Any man who lacks the intellect to work this out is unlikely to be smart enough to play solid poker either.

Take his chips, shouldn`t be too difficult.

Estelle...i haven't seen much of the bad talk at women ( once i remember) but i find that most women play more aggressive at each other than the men vs. women. Thats no bull. I play no different who it is...the cards dictate my play. Good Luck.

I know this is a little old but its a good post. +rep
Alot of people online see my name and think I'm a girl (Jayne) and then when they find out I'm not I noticed that they DO play and act differently towards me. Some people are very nice to me when they think I'm a girl and some are very nasty. Just depends on the character of the opponents.

Great thread Estelle +rep I have to say myself on numerous occassions have experience the abuse you are talking of. I am treated much differently when using my Aloevera compared to Alevera they know i'm a female but when I use Alevera they think I'm male lmfao. Taking money from men is not pleasant (NOT ALL MEN) and it doesn't matter what site it is at, its all the same. I do my best to keep the conversation tame and sometimes I do and sometimes I don't, then I make a decision as too what is the best thing for me too do to achieve the reason why I am here in the first place which is ITM thats when I say I have them but the NUTS and take them out!!!

Not really as bad as swearing at or threatening a women.... but I do have an entertaining story from titan awhile back:

It was a low limit 6max table, 5 men avatars and 1 women avatar. The women in question had chosen an avatar with a red dress and a "healthy" look to her.
One of the guys started filling up the chat box with questions, it progressed kinda like this:

Loser Guy: Are you really a women?
Women: Yes.
Loser Guy: Do you look like your avatar?
Women: No.
Loser Guy: What do you look like?

pause

Loser Guy: Why aren't you answering me?

pause

Women: Cause I'm here to play poker.
Loser Guy: Oh, are you hot?

At this point the whole table started heckling this guy, making fun of him etc. etc. etc. And after a long pause the women replies:

Women: Of course I'm hot, but I'm also 67 years old.

I laughed.

excellent article indeed estelle....women can take advantage of this situation. the ignorant men that think we can't play are usually the first ones to lose to a skilled woman.let them talk their crap and then smile politely as you take their chips. take advantage of their handicap in beleiving women can't play a great game of poker

I admit that my mind wanders a bit when a good looking woman plays the game... there is nothing sexier than a woman proficient at poker, pool, or golf. And reactions of fools makes taking their chips sweet indeed.

I have no sympathy for the 'wounded fawn' routine... I have seen several men lose their stacks to silly little girls who just came to watch their boyfriends play.

I am wary that lustful thoughts may occasionally cloud my judgment. But I am never ungracious to a well played hand. :joyman:

As I always tell people, my mom raised me. She's 5'2", but a very strong woman on the inside. I guess that is why I can relate to women so well. She taught me what women like and about their feelings, but also to respect them the same as a man. You never know when you'll have a woman boss (I've had a few).

I also guess that is why I can treat a woman competitor, in poker or anything else, with the exact same intensity as a man. I'd never hit a woman, but I'd go after just as many of her chips, no matter how fine she is. Just ask JQ.

I often wonder what the reaction would be if some of the vulgar screen names and chat were screened by the players Mother.

I can vouch for the name calling, etc. It does happen and It's not pretty. Yesterday I was playing in a freeroll and happened to take down a huge pot largely by getting a good read on the all-in player as having a straight to the K, when I had outs to the flush and the boat. When the boat came on the river, you should have seen some of the commentary... it ran the gamut from namecalling to open threats against my life. That's a good time to simply close the chat box, take a good long sip of coffee and remember that life is good and donkeys suck at poker.

i know there is one thing not to mess with at the tables!!! The Women!!
the wonmen are no joke at the tables!!

Lana_Faith said:

I can vouch for the name calling, etc. It does happen and It's not pretty. Yesterday I was playing in a freeroll and happened to take down a huge pot largely by getting a good read on the all-in player as having a straight to the K, when I had outs to the flush and the boat. When the boat came on the river, you should have seen some of the commentary... it ran the gamut from namecalling to open threats against my life. That's a good time to simply close the chat box, take a good long sip of coffee and remember that life is good and donkeys suck at poker.

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Well, yes this type of behavior is seen online quite a bit. But one has to realize, that most likely the guy saying that stuff to you, is most likely some guy who normally live, wouldn't have the guts to say it to a woman's face. I think behavior is very different online than it is live, although I have experienced abuse from men at the poker table in live play as well. It's just something we have to deal with. I don't let it get to me at all, I've pretty much heard everything a woman can here at the poker table and off the table, so nothing bothers me much anymore.

i havent really witnessed the name calling but have noticed how some men play women differently. To me it seems like alot of men try too hard to win every pot vs women. Alot of times ill see them play over aggressive thinking they can intimidate them. And i also have seen some very loose calls almost as if they are afraid of being bluffed by a woman. so if your a good woman player you should profit well from their mistakes. hmm After thinking about this makes me want to make up a new account on a pokersite with a girls name and a pic of a cute girl. ill prolly make more money

I get tired of those players who take their frustration out on everyone else when they make bad calls. I like to used the mute option in some of the rooms. Shuts them up quick. Thanks for the information. Very interesting.

it just proves the old saying never judge a book by it's cover

Pushed around and a little trash talk.

Hi Estelle,

I remembered your post today and i was in a ring game on Full Tilt and what i presumed to be a woman (name and avatar /the ugly green one). Kept raisin in to me three times when i had the nuts . I only called and after each hand there was some chat at the table. Nothin nasty all in humor. Until i said "did you ever see anything that ugly " and she left the table. I dont think that is any different that what the men do. I hope she didn't think it was sexist. Poker has to be played the same whoever it is.

RochesterRalph said:

Hi Estelle,

I remembered your post today and i was in a ring game on Full Tilt and what i presumed to be a woman (name and avatar /the ugly green one). Kept raisin in to me three times when i had the nuts . I only called and after each hand there was some chat at the table. Nothin nasty all in humor. Until i said "did you ever see anything that ugly " and she left the table. I dont think that is any different that what the men do. I hope she didn't think it was sexist. Poker has to be played the same whoever it is.

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Um, I don't understand. Are you saying that you do insult and abuse women at the poker table? If so, then I don't think advertising this is a great idea at this forum or anywhere else.

Hott,

I took from Ralphs post a pun, he lost, and the AVATAR he lost to was ugly. And if it is the one I think it is, it is UGLY!
I saw nothing resembling a slur, but some good natured wordplay. Lest you think it is not, remember that BBB has a high pair.

i get berated a lot because i look so young. most people don't believe im 16, let alone 22.

Strange coincidence, that. Most people don`t believe I`m 16.



Or 22.



Even though I have been.