What I like to call all inners and A experiment to see how many times I can do it

S

Silvershade

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jul 30, 2008
Total posts
8
Chips
0
Hey guys


Ive been testing well more of a experiment of all in on the first hand most new or just silly player wait for a 180 360 freeroll. I have been keeping a tab of doing it myself im shooting for 50 times and im listing the cards I was dealt so you could gather more info on Full Tilts RNG or Random Number Gen. when im finished if you would like a copy post or you may E mail me deskenIVs@hotmail.com

Thanks
New Member

Dow D. O'Neal III
 
mregister2

mregister2

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Total posts
69
Chips
0
This sounds interesting. One thing to keep in mind with hold'em is that with four or five players all-in at once, even the strongest hand is an underdog to win.

Here's an experiment for you to illustrate this. Take a deck of cards and deal out four to five hold'em hands. Then deal a flop, turn and river. You'd be surprised how often the best starting hand doesn't win.
 
Double-A

Double-A

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Total posts
787
Chips
0
???

This sounds interesting. One thing to keep in mind with hold'em is that with four or five players all-in at once, even the strongest hand is an underdog to win.

Here's an experiment for you to illustrate this. Take a deck of cards and deal out four to five hold'em hands. Then deal a flop, turn and river. You'd be surprised how often the best starting hand doesn't win.

If the strongest hand is an underdog to win then how is it the strongest hand???
 
NascarFanSS

NascarFanSS

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 6, 2008
Total posts
649
Chips
0
If the strongest hand is an underdog to win then how is it the strongest hand???


Stronger cards have a higher percentage of taking any given hand initially, but when you have 3 out of 5 calling all in on strong cards which isn't figured into the percentage I believe that gives what I would like to call donkey cards unfortunately the better odds on even just a stand alone pair.
 
Double-A

Double-A

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Total posts
787
Chips
0
Stronger cards have a higher percentage of taking any given hand initially, but when you have 3 out of 5 calling all in on strong cards which isn't figured into the percentage I believe that gives what I would like to call donkey cards unfortunately the better odds on even just a stand alone pair.

Four or more callers may have more equity together than any specific two card holding but... The strongest hand is still the strongest hand, still has more equity than any other two cards, and is NOT an underdog.

Unless you're just considering every hand to be an underdog...
 
H

hornellfred

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
May 22, 2008
Total posts
86
Chips
0
If the strongest hand is an underdog to win then how is it the strongest hand???

The strongest "starting hand," is only the strongest until the flop comes out. Let's say you have AA and you go all-in UTG and you get 4 callers. AA is a 75% winner against any random hand. This means that all 4 callers have a 25% chance of winning the hand. You are still the favorite to win but you are less than 50%, since you have 4 with a 25% chance of winning. Obviously, the less callers the better and going all-in early in a micro or freeroll is not a good move.
 
N

neviu

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2008
Total posts
52
Chips
0
you never whant that many callers even whit a monsterhand
preflopp so many all ins give you trouble on the flop
or luck its a gamble you take or dont
 
S

stuventus

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Total posts
167
Chips
0
He means that it is an underdog to win against all of the other hands combined. He just didnt word it well.

for example
5 starting hands AA,AT,56,JJ,28

AA is fave against AT head to head
AA is fave against 56 head to head
AA is fave against JJ head to head
AA is fave against 28 head to head


BUT

28,JJ,56 and AT combined are fave against AA

hope this clears it up - you are not playing against each hand individually - you are playing against them combined. i.e you must beat them all to take the pot.
 
I

icepick007

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 13, 2008
Total posts
66
Chips
0
nice experiment...i am eager to know the results.frankly speaking theres no other way to win those 180,and 360 player sng freerolls...won them a couple of times,but the level of play makes yu so sick...yu really need a huge chiplead,and need to suckout chips thereon...dats probably the only yu can win these tournies...anyone had better success at these tournies
 
Z

zuberman

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Total posts
25
Chips
0
In that underdog thing, I think he says that the strongest hand is an underdog to all other hands combined. Other than that, it can be never true.
 
Z

zuberman

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Total posts
25
Chips
0
sorry stuvendus. I didn't saw you've written your post. Nicely put, yours is more explanatory.
 
mregister2

mregister2

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Total posts
69
Chips
0
He means that it is an underdog to win against all of the other hands combined. He just didnt word it well.


That is exactly what I meant.Thanks for clarifying that for me.
 
S

Silvershade

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jul 30, 2008
Total posts
8
Chips
0
Deck of cards

ty I will try that with the deck I have been a ling time player and I really wanted to see for myself again if you guys want the final result E mail me or PM

Thanx
Dow
 
NascarFanSS

NascarFanSS

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 6, 2008
Total posts
649
Chips
0
nice experiment...i am eager to know the results.frankly speaking theres no other way to win those 180,and 360 player sng freerolls...won them a couple of times,but the level of play makes yu so sick...yu really need a huge chiplead,and need to suckout chips thereon...dats probably the only yu can win these tournies...anyone had better success at these tournies

Silvershade and I have had great success on a nightly basis with the 180's without going all-in first hand. Who knows how many you could lose til you get that chip stack that in the beginning I thought was necessary as well.

I have been playing the 180 peep SnGs for a few months now and if I sit down with patience I can usually win 1 a night or every other night. You do not have to go all-in first hand but if you are to succeed in the long run you will be going all-in on traps and with a lil luck and some good cards final table is where the real play begins. Folding is an absolute must, the donkeys will put themselves out. I have made it to final table with 6k and gone from short stack to chip leader in 5min with smart and patient play.
 
Last edited:
Double-A

Double-A

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Total posts
787
Chips
0
He means that it is an underdog to win against all of the other hands combined. He just didnt word it well.

for example
5 starting hands AA,AT,56,JJ,28

AA is fave against AT head to head
AA is fave against 56 head to head
AA is fave against JJ head to head
AA is fave against 28 head to head


BUT

28,JJ,56 and AT combined are fave against AA

hope this clears it up - you are not playing against each hand individually - you are playing against them combined. i.e you must beat them all to take the pot.

EACH hand faces the combined equity of the other hands. In the example you gave AA is the strongest hand (has the most equity) no matter how you slice it.

The strongest hand is the strongest hand because it's the favorite. By definition it can't be an underdog.
 
Double-A

Double-A

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Total posts
787
Chips
0
The strongest "starting hand," is only the strongest until the flop comes out. Let's say you have AA and you go all-in UTG and you get 4 callers. AA is a 75% winner against any random hand. This means that all 4 callers have a 25% chance of winning the hand. You are still the favorite to win but you are less than 50%, since you have 4 with a 25% chance of winning. Obviously, the less callers the better and going all-in early in a micro or freeroll is not a good move.

AA is 56% against 4 random hands. Each random hand has around an 11% chance to take down the pot. Combined the random hands have a 46% chance. AA is the favorite not the dog.
 
H

hornellfred

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
May 22, 2008
Total posts
86
Chips
0
AA is 56% against 4 random hands. Each random hand has around an 11% chance to take down the pot. Combined the random hands have a 46% chance. AA is the favorite not the dog.

Are Aces a 89% favorite against any random hand?
 
sandbender

sandbender

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 30, 2008
Total posts
95
Chips
0
LOL, just got dealt AA first hand of a SNG, thought of this thread and went all-in. So TOTALLY unlike me.

Of course I got busted by a known maniac with JJ. So that's the end of my $8.80 experiment!
 
Top