Seeing Opponents Cards

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Sdtex

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I wasn't sure of the proper poker protocol or etiquette in this situation, but I was playing in a $220 tournament at The Bellagio last summer and the older gentleman to my left was next to act. As I looked over at him he picked up his cards without even the slightest attempt to cup or hide his cards and they were plainly visible to me. I looked away right away, though it was clear what his cards were. He continued throughout the game picking up his cards in the same manner, even though I did make mention that he should try to protect his cards.
Please know that I never leaned back to try to view his cards or anything that would be construed as "cheating", but my question, I guess is since this gentleman decided to continually show his cards in such a manner, should I continue to look over at them or do I do the "right" thing and avert my eyes every time it was his turn to act. I try to read tells at times and to not be able to even look at my opponent doesn't seem right for me either. Is poker like golf or every other sport where you try to get every advantage you can.
 
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mikejm

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Don't look over at him with the intention of seeing his cards look with the intention of reading him when he looks down. If he doesn't protect his cards and you accidentally see something its 100% his fault and don't feel bad using this information in a hand.
 
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Sdtex

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That was my thoughts, too, Mike. I tried to convey that I wasn't looking over at him with the intent to see his cards, but I was getting uncomfortable (maybe that was his plan all along, maybe he wanted me to see his bad cards, setting me up for a great bluff when he protected his cards!!) ;-) Anyway, the person sitting across from me noticed one time and I just shrugged......he asked "did you get a good look?". I said "yeah, I guess so" . Oh well......thanks for your reply, Mike.
 
tusabes

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It's his job to protect his cards. The best way to pick up tells is to see what he's holding and then how he acts. You might be sitting on the opposite side of the table from him later on. When ever I'm sitting next to this type of player I look everytime. I would never tell a player he's showing me his/her cards.

If a pitcher is tipping his curveball would a hitter ever tell him? It's a game and those cards are the game pieces. He's a playing poorly and deserves to be crushed :)
 
thegrinder-26

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i agree with everyone he needs to protect his hand but u shouldnt look either it kills the integrity of the game
 
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Mikeg

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I would quite happily and without shame take a look at his cards every hand, hopefully getting all of his chips off him when the perfect opportunity arose, sending that old ****er home, goodnight grandpa
 
fletchdad

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You will get every variety of answer to this from "Its cheating, dont look" to "Use the info, bro!!! Its poker to win money, and advantage is a good one"

I think a lot of "I wont look" players will actually look. A selected few will actually not.

It IS poker, and if he is playing bad, well, its our job to exploit weakness, and whether he telegraphs his play with tells, or shows his cards, you take the info you have and use it. The comment on, see what he has and how he plays it is a great one if this is a guy you may play again!!

You need to follow your own conscience here. If it was me, it would depend on my take on him. Is he a rich old fella with money to burn, or is he trying to get money for his grandsons bail? Of course you cant know, but certain things can be more apparent. As well, how is he as a person? Is he an arrogant dick? Look, and look again. Is he an amateur, who seems to be a nice but clueless guy? Find a moment and let him know he needs to pay attention to not show his cards. Since you mentioned having done that, you have done all you can do.

Maybe he likes you and wants you to take his money????
 
pokerman27

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I would quite happily and without shame take a look at his cards every hand, hopefully getting all of his chips off him when the perfect opportunity arose, sending that old ****er home, goodnight grandpa

Welcome to the forum...less attitude.
 
ben_rhyno

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There's nothing wrong with his response lol, take that old man to value town and leave him there, you get to feel like potripper for the day
 
pokerman27

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There's nothing wrong with his response lol, take that old man to value town and leave him there, you get to feel like potripper for the day

I think the same point can be made without the superflous 'old f*****' comment. That's just ignorance.
 
Zorba

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Tell them once, tell them twice, then if they still do it use the info to your advantage.


There's nothing wrong with his response lol, take that old man to value town and leave him there, you get to feel like potripper for the day
Yes there was, not all grandpa's are OLD, there are some young ****er's that are grandpa's :D
 
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tusabes

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A little brashness isn't all bad. Attitude has entertainment value. He probably likes to raise raise and reraise 3,4, and 5 hands in a row. I like the killer instinct. Hook that fish and gut'em when he hits the deck :)
 
Mortis

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It's a players responsibility to protect their cards. You even mentioned to him to cover his cards up, and he continued doing what he was doing. It's his own fault. You did nothing wrong. Although, I won't actively try to look at another players cards, but if he is showing them, I'm going to look.
 
ben_rhyno

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Tell them once, tell them twice, then if they still do it use the info to your advantage.



Yes there was, not all grandpa's are OLD, there are some young ****er's that are grandpa's :D
I class 50 as old, and most grandparents are 50+,, so I'm taking a guess and sticking with the old comment ;)
 
fletchdad

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I class 50 as old, and most grandparents are 50+,, so I'm taking a guess and sticking with the old comment ;)


watch that 50=old shit there young un...........
 
Olddog21

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You tried warning him.....it may of been his attempt to MAKE you feel uncomfortable at the table...maybe speaker to the dealer might have helped here....or floor person?
 
SilentJay

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Nice guys finish last. It's not just a saying. (I should know... but that's another story.)

If you openly tell him that you can see his cards, and he keeps doing it - fair game, if you ask me. It hardly qualifies as cheating - something I do not condone.
 
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budebuzz

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This is a good question, I never feel comfortable in that situation. I personally don't look because it messes up my play. I feel it's their responsibility to cover their cards and I really hate saying something to either the player or the dealer, should I say something or just not look?
 
Leo 50

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I have been in this situation as well
If they don't realize they are showing their cards, politely tell them.
Maybe they are really new to live play, maybe they just are nervous at a live table.
If you let them know and they continue to do it then if you happen to see their cards it isn't your fault.

:cool:
 
MediaBLITZ

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The best answer I have heard to this often asked questioned went something like this.

After the hand is over and before the next is dealt, lean into the player (so that the rest of the table is not in on it) and tell him flat out- not that you can see his cards - but that HE IS SHOWING HIS CARDS to you when he looks at them. Then tell him you will not mention it again and the rest is up to him. Make him responsible for it, not you.

SIDE TRACK STORY
Had this happen at a bar game where we rotated the deal - there was one guy across from me that I could see every card he peeled off the deck. I knew everyone's hand, I announced MISDEAL and of course this halted the action and no one could figure out what happened. I went around the table, starting to the left of the dealer, pointing at people and saying, "K of Spades - 6 of Clubs - A of Hearts - etc..." And told everyone I knew what their cards where. The dealer was pissed and so were his two buddies (Hmmmmmmm.....) like I was the bad guy - I said, "Fine, I won't bring it up again, but I will be looking." He took more care after that.

But if the guy next to me doesn't take more care after I have warned him - I will look and I will use it.
 
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bigpick76

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its an integrity issue when u look to TRY to see his cards or in some way cheat.....but if your looking at you opp. and hes pretty much exposing his hand its not your fault .....its like picking up a tell.....he should be aware of what hes doing as all poker players should have keeping their cards out of view of other players should be their #1 concern, but if hes gonna clearly expose his hand for you and anyone else to see then by all means use it to your advantage, thats the second thing all poker players are trying to do pick up a players weakness and exploit it, hes just making it real easy so by no means should YOU feel bad, but HE shouldnt be that stupid
 
jazzaxe

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Anything in plain view can be and should be used to your advantage. It is indeed the player's obligation to protect his cards. If the cards are in plain view then he would be responsible. The opposite might be asked of someone who hides his face with sunglasses or a hood while playing to protect against any information his facial expressions would convey. There does not seem to be any guilt associated with this. If you are playing with your friends for fun, it is one thing, but if you are playing in public against essentially strangers, you are entitled to use all the information available, including the cards they unintentionally show you.
 
Vfranks

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I've heard people say that it is the players responsibility to cover up/take care of their own cards, so if they show them it is their own fault. I play a lot of free bar poker, or small cash games with friends... so I will tell someone they are showing me their cards, but usually it is a friend/acquaintance, or someone you can tell has no clue about poker since it's a free bar league. Sometimes people are just at the bar and when they learn it is free poker, so they want to play, even though they don't know what a SB/BB is lol. So most of the time I feel obligated to inform them at least once, especially if you can tell they are a beginner and clueless to begin with.. I mean the inexperienced payers tend to lose pretty quickly anyway.
I've never had this problem at an actual card room though, just more at the free poker level.
 
rssurfer54

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The best answer I have heard to this often asked questioned went something like this.

After the hand is over and before the next is dealt, lean into the player (so that the rest of the table is not in on it) and tell him flat out- not that you can see his cards - but that HE IS SHOWING HIS CARDS to you when he looks at them. Then tell him you will not mention it again and the rest is up to him. Make him responsible for it, not you.

This.
 
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yotalover

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I think you've done every thing right. Letting him know to hide his cards better is something I would do, but a lot of players wouldn't even do that.

Commendable for your efforts to be fair. Otherwise, I agree with the crowd in that If he's gonna inadvertantly give you information, use it.

Gl in the future.
Yota
 
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