Poker Mindset Questionnaire Part 1 (yes, cake, bastard, all there!)

Poker Mindset Questionnaire Part 1:
I've read many a debate on the subject of poker. Most debates seem to revolve around the same questions, same principals, same theories, etc;

Inquiring minds want to know, my mind wants to know, where do you stand on these debates and more importantly: why?

In lieu of having multiple threads (which we already do) with just one question per thread, and in hopes of avoiding multiple more being created with the same questions every six months or so, I've created a questionnaire that I hope encompasses all the typical questions that are normally asked/debated. I hope all will participate in and answer the questions truthfully.

I've noticed that as players gain more experience, age, and/or there is a shift in general societies viewpoint, that people's mindset seems to change or alter a bit. Please feel free to come back to this thread at a later date if you have a new viewpoint to share. If you change your mind on a question, please state why.

*This questionnaire is long, therefore I have broken it into two separate threads, part 1 & part 2. If you have the patience to answer all the questions that would be appreciated. If there is a particular question/topic that is near and dear to you, feel free to make a separate post with a more detailed answer/viewpoint. Of course if there are some questions you are not comfortable answering then skip them. (I have saved the best question for last).

Section I:
1. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in poker, why?
2. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in being a poker professional, why?
1. & 2. a) If your answers are different for questions 1 &2, please give a brief explanation as to why.
3. Do you believe there are some instances where poker is gambling and some instances where poker is not gambling, or is poker always gambling or always not gambling? Please explain.
4. Is there a distinction between poker players and gamblers who play poker? Why or why not?
5. Is poker a sport? Why or why not?
5. a) If you said no, do you want it to be classified as such, why or why not?
Section II:
6. How long have you been playing poker?
7. Do you play home games, in charity rooms, casinos and/or online?
7 a) Which form do you prefer and why?
8. How much time do you spend playing poker? (Please break this down per form of poker played and total hours played at each form, such as 5 hrs per month casino, 4 hrs per week home games, 10 hrs per week online, etc; Also please put in a total number of hours you play at all forms, your choice of per day, per week, per month, etc
9. Do you play poker for fun or profits?
10. Are you a profitable poker player?
10.a) If no to 10, is your goal to become a profitable player?
11..Is poker your main source of income?
11. a) If no to 11, is your goal for poker to be your main source of income? Why or why not?
12. Is poker a partial source of income?
13. Do you study poker?
13. a) If yes to 13, in what way(s)?
Section III:
14. Do you believe poker is a legitimate job/career? Why or why not?
15. How do you believe society as a whole views poker players?
15. a) Does this sway your personal viewpoint, why or why not?
16. Is it okay for those under the age of 18 to learn to play poker? Why or why not?
16. a) If yes to 16, at what age is it okay for those under the age of 18 to begin participating playing poker in big home games? (Big meaning, where friends and family members participate, not just those living in the home with the child as a "family fun night".) Please explain your answer.
Section IV:
17. What country do you live in?
17. a) Is live poker legal where you live?
17. b) Is online poker legal where you live?
17. c) If you answered no to 17a/b, do you want poker to be legal in this form, why or why not?
17. d) If you answered yes to 17c, what steps/measures/actions have you taken to assist in making poker legal in this form?
Section V:
Inquiring minds want to know, make your best case on the hot topic below:
18. Cake, Pie, Brownies or Bastard, why?

StormRaven said:

Section I:
1. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in poker, why?
I'd have to say easily, that it is a game of skill. With just the little bit of skill that I have aqcuired, my win rate does nothing but improve. In the long run, everyone will see the same amount of cards and will experience the same amount of crazy one card suck outs. You don't see the same people raking in pot after pot if it was all luck.

2. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in being a poker professional, why?
My answer is the exact same.

1. & 2. a) If your answers are different for questions 1 &2, please give a brief explanation as to why.
3. Do you believe there are some instances where poker is gambling and some instances where poker is not gambling, or is poker always gambling or always not gambling? Please explain.
Poker is ALWAYS gambling. It is just like every other casino game (in the aspect of luck and expected value). Black Jack is a gambling game and you can have an advantage over the house. Just because poker is beatable doesn't make it not a gambling game. No amount of skill will take that out. Yes, that skill will make you a winner over the people you are playin against and will give you an edge, but poker is a game of incomplete information. You can never take all the chance out of it.

4. Is there a distinction between poker players and gamblers who play poker? Why or why not?
Yes, there is a huge difference between the two. It comes down to one thing, expected value. A poker player is trying to get his money in good while a gambler is looking for that long shot, one in a million, make hte big bucks quick, hand. The gambler is there for the rush, not to play poker.

5. Is poker a sport? Why or why not?
To me, not at all. It is a gambling game with skill but not a sport. A sport is "an active diversion requiring physical exertion and competition". Staying awake and paying very close attention are not physical exertions.

5. a) If you said no, do you want it to be classified as such, why or why not?
No, it shouldn't be. If poker should be classified as a sport, why not stock trading, or knot tieing, or school for that matter (all night cramming can be very demanding). There is a place for poker (a very big place in my mind) but the sporting arena is not one of them.

Section II:
6. How long have you been playing poker?
Close to a year now, a little under.
7. Do you play home games, in charity rooms, casinos and/or online?
I play a few home games, but by and large I play online
7 a) Which form do you prefer and why?
Online. It's hard to beat sitting around in your underwear with a beer and playing poker. I don't have to drive to a casino and deal with stupid people. I can sit at home and still be around my wife and can do as I please.
8. How much time do you spend playing poker? (Please break this down per form of poker played and total hours played at each form, such as 5 hrs per month casino, 4 hrs per week home games, 10 hrs per week online, etc; Also please put in a total number of hours you play at all forms, your choice of per day, per week, per month, etc
I probably only play about 5-7hrs a week playing poker. Sometimes it will be alot more but there are also times where I won't play poker. Studying poker on the other hand is a different story. I put in way to many hours doing that.
9. Do you play poker for fun or profits?
Both. When I first started playing poker, I sucked. I'm a fairly smart guy and it pissed me off that I sucked so bad at a game that was all about out witting other people. I HAD to get better at it, but I also and enjoy the hell out of the challange
10. Are you a profitable poker player?
I have showed about a $50 profit over all. So I guess so, but I'm just getting started.
10.a) If no to 10, is your goal to become a profitable player?
N/A
11..Is poker your main source of income?
No. If it were I would be one broke son of a..... never mind.
11. a) If no to 11, is your goal for poker to be your main source of income? Why or why not?
I'd never want it to be my main source of income, but a nice little side income would be great. I enjoy poker to much for it to be "work". If I had to pay my bills and eat with my earnings, I don't think I'd enjoy it much anymore. However, going on a trip, taking my wife out to a night on the town, and buying some toys, sounds great.
12. Is poker a partial source of income?
If less then $1/hr counts as income, sure.
13. Do you study poker?
Very much so.
13. a) If yes to 13, in what way(s)?
I spend way to many hours a week studying poker. I've read about 15 books, watched tons of "tutorial" videos, browsed every forum I can find, and read every article I can find. I don't really have anyone to talk to about poker but hopefully I"ll find one soon (not including the forum posts, but a single person to chat with about it).
Section III:
14. Do you believe poker is a legitimate job/career? Why or why not?
Anything the government can tax you on is a legit. career isn't it? If you can make money doing something, I think it is a legit. career.
15. How do you believe society as a whole views poker players?
It has come along way from Doyle Brunson's day's I'm sure, but it still isn't that great of an image. It's either bad, or the person has no idea what to say about it and doesn't know much at all.
15. a) Does this sway your personal viewpoint, why or why not?
Not at all. I really couldn't care what people think of me, in life or poker.
16. Is it okay for those under the age of 18 to learn to play poker? Why or why not?
Yes, I don't see why it is illegal for them to even play (or gamble at all for that matter). I lived in vegas for a good while. When my parents took us to the casino, my brother and I dumped tons of money into the arcades there. What is the difference between that and a slot machine? I'm still dumping money like crazy, but I don't get any kind of return. I think it is totally bogus.
16. a) If yes to 16, at what age is it okay for those under the age of 18 to begin participating playing poker in big home games? (Big meaning, where friends and family members participate, not just those living in the home with the child as a "family fun night".) Please explain your answer.
Once is kid is old enough to understand what is going on, I think it is more than fine. It should definitly be up to the parent, and they should make their own judgement call though. Like I said up above I don't see anything wrong with it. The kid could also learn a lot from playing poker. It could very easily be a way to encourage math skills, logic, reasoning, social skills (a lot of kids need help there), respect, mannars.
Section IV:
17. What country do you live in?
usa
17. a) Is live poker legal where you live?
Yeah, I just moved back to Arizona so they have a ton of indian casinos and poker rooms.
17. b) Is online poker legal where you live?
Yes, if it ever isn't this place can kiss my.... rear.
17. c) If you answered no to 17a/b, do you want poker to be legal in this form, why or why not?
N/A
17. d) If you answered yes to 17c, what steps/measures/actions have you taken to assist in making poker legal in this form?
None so far, but if it gets any worse I'll do my best to help.
Section V:
Inquiring minds want to know, make your best case on the hot topic below:
18. Cake, Pie, Brownies or Bastard, why?
Pie, because I'm a dirty man. Dirty, dirty.

Click to expand...

Answered above. That's just my two cents any way.

I'll get this started...

1. Skill. Short term luck will help out the vast majority of players but only long term skill will make a serious poker player a profitable player. Those who rely on luck will lose in the long run.
2. Without a doubt skill. In a major sport you wouldn't be recruited because you had a tendency to get lucky, skill is what gets you recruited. Same for the pro poker player, skill is what makes you a pro and skill is what will keep you as a pro.
3. Yes, it varies. I don't consider poker a gamble myself. I play a game which requires logical deduction, mathematics and many other strategies, therefore I believe for me poker is a game of skill, not a gamble. Depending if you are philosophical or not whether it's a gamble I guess. So many say "Life is a gamble", "getting in your car and driving to work is a gamble", etc; So it varies on your philosophical viewpoints.
4. Absolutely! There are those that take poker seriously and those who don't. That's really the simple difference to me.
5. No. Not in the way sports are currently classified. Sports are physically active games, like football, basketball, etc; The dictionary says "athletic activity requiring physical prowess...".
5. Yes and no. I'd like to see the wsop listed as such. ESPN airs it, Fox Sports airs it, etc; Large poker tourneys like the WPT & WSOP are very competitive, so are smaller ones. I wouldn't mind seeing Texas Hold Em listed as a sport. It wouldn't break my heart though if it never was classified as such.

6. Since I was a little kid. I started playing for real money in real home games (not just games with mom & dad) at 16 so 21 years now I've played seriously.
7. All the above.
7 a - I prefer a few of the forms. Online because I don't have to leave the house, convenience in many forms, can play multi tables at once. Casino because I am good playing live, good with reads and enjoy the atmosphere. Home Games because they are so fun.
8. 20-30 hrs online per week. 20-25 hrs per week casino. 4 hrs per month home games. So about 40-50 hrs per week on avg.
9. Profits
10. Not online. Yes to live play.
10 a - Always.
11. No
11 a - eventually. I love to play it and I'd rather work for myself making money doing what I love then working somewhere I hate or don't like for a guaranteed pay check.
12. Yes.
13. Yes
13 a - read books, read articles online, participate in poker forum, watch videos, etc;

14. Yes. There are many who treat poker like a job and get paid very well doing it. I realize for some it's just game, but for others, it's a career.
15. As a whole, telling joe q public that you are a poker player is the same as telling them you are a drug addict. As a whole, most of society labels poker with preconceived notions of gambling addicts. They don't research it or try to properly understand it in order to make informed decisions.
15 a - Absolutely not! Some members of society are too quick to jump on bandwagons about topics they truly don't understand. I won't allow another to make up my mind on a topic, I prefer to research it myself and draw my own conclusions.
16. Yes. It's a game. You don't have a problem teaching your child to play candyland, chutes & ladders, uno or go fish, so why have a problem teaching them the card game of poker?
16 a - Sixteen. They are old enough to drive and go to work, they are old enough to play for money in a controlled environment like a home game.

17. USA
17 a - Yes - in casinos and at home (but only if homeowners aren't taking a rake).
17 b- Yes and no. It's not officially a state law in Michigan saying it's illegal to play poker online but with the UIGEA I foresee it becoming one.
17 c - Yes I want poker to be legal online.
17 d - I have joined the PPA and written letters to my congressman and state representatives.

18. Brownies! I love cake and pie as well, never tried bastard. But with brownies you can cook "things" into them (well, only when I was younger, not now). The most compelling reason brownies are the obvious choice is you can warm them up, layer ice cream, hot fudge and whip cream on top! Mmmmmmmmmm!!!!!

Section I:
1. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in poker, why?
2. Do you believe there is more luck or skill involved in being a poker professional, why?
1. & 2. a) If your answers are different for questions 1 &2, please give a brief explanation as to why.
3. Do you believe there are some instances where poker is gambling and some instances where poker is not gambling, or is poker always gambling or always not gambling? Please explain.
4. Is there a distinction between poker players and gamblers who play poker? Why or why not?


All the above can be answered at once. One can force poker to be completely about luck if one plays with no knowledge of the game and of mathematical principals. Similarly, one can acquire and use skill in such a way that luck becomes almost an insignificant factor over the long run. How much luck or skill there is in poker depends entirely on how one chooses to play it. This is however a long term view only. Any players short term results are much more influenced by luck. If one gets their money in as a 70/30 favorite 10 times in one session and loses 8 of these hands, that's just dumb bad luck (aka bad variance). Over time however, this is insignificant as you will average winning 7 and losing 3 of these 10 hands. Your skill is what told you this was a profitable situation to push. Someone with little to no skill will routinely put money in "bad" and not understand why this is so... all that matters to them is the outcome of the current hand... if they win they played it right, if they loose they played it wrong. This attitude will occasionally result in a winning session, but every single player who plays this way will go broke given that they play poker long enough.

I do not expect anyone who is truly a poker professional to have a game that is anything but skill dominated.

As for "is it gambling"... this is more of a semantics question than anything. By a literal definition of "gambling involves the wagering of money on an uncertain outcome" then yes absolutely poker is gambling and everyone who plays it is gambling regardless of skill. However, this does not get to the heart of the matter and the real question being asked is "Is poker an inherently risky and unpredictable endeavor." The answer to this is an emphatic "not if you know what you are doing!" Besides, by a literal definition of "gambling", virtually any form of financial investment is gambling... and one could quite easily argue more risky than poker given sufficient skill.

5. Is poker a sport? Why or why not?
5. a) If you said no, do you want it to be classified as such, why or why not?

Meh... in my opinion this is largely irrelevant and only depends on what you consider a "sport". I guess it comes down to if you consider sports to require physical exertion of some type or not. If poker is a sport than so are things like chess or darts .

Section II:
6. How long have you been playing poker?

Uh... 8 years or so?

7. Do you play home games, in charity rooms, casinos and/or online?

Almost exclusively online.. occasional home games and less occasional casino trips (I like casinos, just don't live remotely close to one)

7 a) Which form do you prefer and why?
8. How much time do you spend playing poker? (Please break this down per form of poker played and total hours played at each form, such as 5 hrs per month casino, 4 hrs per week home games, 10 hrs per week online, etc; Also please put in a total number of hours you play at all forms, your choice of per day, per week, per month, etc

Really, really really varies...

I'm rather sporadic and have been known to take long breaks but i've also been known to play 20-25 hours a week or more somewhat regularly.

9. Do you play poker for fun or profits?

both.

10. Are you a profitable poker player?

not as much as I'd like, but yes.

10.a) If no to 10, is your goal to become a profitable player?
11..Is poker your main source of income?

No.

11. a) If no to 11, is your goal for poker to be your main source of income? Why or why not?

Not at this time, but it's something I have considered.

12. Is poker a partial source of income?

Usually.

13. Do you study poker?

Yes.

13. a) If yes to 13, in what way(s)?

Books, training sites (stoxpoker etc), reviewing and studying my own past sessions, sweat sessions with other players, discussing hands on forums.

Section III:
14. Do you believe poker is a legitimate job/career? Why or why not?

Yes absolutely, but I also think it's much harder to do successfully than many think it is.

15. How do you believe society as a whole views poker players?

Overall? Poorly, and usually this is motivated by stereotypes that display poker players as degenerate gamblers and generally worthless, shifty individuals.

15. a) Does this sway your personal viewpoint, why or why not?

Nope. I couldn't care less if others want to judge me on false stereotypes. Their loss.

16. Is it okay for those under the age of 18 to learn to play poker? Why or why not?

If done in a responsible manner, absolutely and I encourage it. Good money management should be taught along with it.

I think poker can be used as a tool to teach many great things to teens and to encourage an interest in math.

16. a) If yes to 16, at what age is it okay for those under the age of 18 to begin participating playing poker in big home games? (Big meaning, where friends and family members participate, not just those living in the home with the child as a "family fun night".) Please explain your answer.

I do not encourage anything illegal. I also think that everybody is different and there isn't really an "age" at which this suddenly becomes ok. If it's done responsibly who cares? What business is it of anyone elses?

Section IV:
17. What country do you live in?

US

17. a) Is live poker legal where you live?

Big organized games with rakes, no (I can still name you 5 different ones within 30 minutes) Home games? Probably.

17. b) Is online poker legal where you live?

Yes

17. c) If you answered no to 17a/b, do you want poker to be legal in this form, why or why not?

It's my money and nobody elses damn business what I do with it. So yes, it should be completely legal.

Same goes for online poker, the UIGEA was a sad joke and should be repealed.

HOWEVER, if they repeal it and start charging taxes that make it impossible to win at a decent rate... well... that would be rather pointless wouldn't it?

17. d) If you answered yes to 17c, what steps/measures/actions have you taken to assist in making poker legal in this form?

written letters to congress/senate members from my state, joined the PPA.


18. Cake, Pie, Brownies or Bastard, why?

CAKE!