Need some business minded people to answer this question.

I have been selling my play money chips for real money chips for little over a year along with winning freeroll money on pokerstars . I was thinking , I know allot of people do the same thing . So if so many people did this and never deposited their own money , Would that cause any disruption of any kind to the poker site . Could it cause in negative effects to the poker sites business ? If more and more people do sell their play chips for real money chips and the volume of the people doing this gets larger and larger would it have a negative effect on the poker sites business

if their is negative effects towards the poker sites business , wouldn't it be wise for them to keep track of these players that never buy in with their own money ? I think if i was the poker site i would want to know this , And if I found that their was a negative effect i would want to do something about it !!! What would that something be ????

Thanks for your time ,
Sincerely Tony

Enough players will play for real buy-ins (pay rake) to cover the Freeroll Whores and tons of profit for the sites.

Most people after they play for real money ,dont want to go back to super small wins.

freerolls are generally a training ground for paying players later.

I hope this helps.


Snow

You sell 1M chips for $5 or whatever, to a middle man who turns around and sells them for $8 how is that a drain?

Free-rolls are to get people hooked.

When you get money in a free-roll you then turn around and play games with rake. You will give back more in rake than you won in the free-roll or loose it to someone. Free-rolls are just a way to keep the sites popular.

These sites are raking way more than they give out in free-rolls.

bigjoker66 said:

You sell 1M chips for $5 or whatever, to a middle man who turns around and sells them for $8 how is that a drain?

Free-rolls are to get people hooked.

When you get money in a free-roll you then turn around and play games with rake. You will give back more in rake than you won in the free-roll or loose it to someone. Free-rolls are just a way to keep the sites popular.

These sites are raking way more than they give out in free-rolls.

Click to expand...

Hey so is that why I feel so safer playing mtts (not paying rake every hand I play) cause you and Snow seem to know that rake is a big part in this subject. Funny thing is I do very well in mtts . Then soon as I sit down at a ring game I get beat with my huge hands against other huge hands . So about my thinking that maybe the poker site would want to track people that are making money but have not put any of their real money of their own into their account that the poker site would pick ring games to watch those players who have not put in their own money in their account yet ?

bigjoker66 said:

You sell 1M chips for $5 or whatever, to a middle man who turns around and sells them for $8 how is that a drain?

Free-rolls are to get people hooked.

When you get money in a free-roll you then turn around and play games with rake. You will give back more in rake than you won in the free-roll or loose it to someone. Free-rolls are just a way to keep the sites popular.

These sites are raking way more than they give out in free-rolls.

Click to expand...

haha and only pay so many places its sickning.......still waiting for my poker patch in the mail!!!!

Pretty sure it has zero effect.

The money got on the site somehow and it's staying on the site. The fact that it's in your account, not someone else's, and they gave it to you in exchange for nearly-worthless play money is irrelevant: the site still holds the exact same amount in deposits as they did before the exchange and they don't care who plays with the cash as long as someone is playing with it and paying rake / tournament fees when they do.

The business case for freerolls is a slightly different matter, basically the sites figure the amount they lose in freeroll prize money is worth it for the number of players that get drawn in by them - a lot of whom will get frustrated and just deposit their own money long before they manage to build an actual bankroll from freeroll winnings.

As indicated by OzExorcist, providing freerolls = cost of doing business...the site will be able to write it off as an expense. Additionally, any monies players have on deposit with a site = liability to that site (it is not their money, it's the players' money) until a portion of it is earned via rake &/or tournament buy ins. Play chips = zero value >>> if someone is exchanging them for $$ chips, that transaction is outside the scope of the site since it is between individuals & has -0- impact on a site's financials (if that is the direction the ??? was leading?).

As long as money goes round on the site and rake or tourneyfees are collected, no site is going to care, where the money came from...
GL
aC

It is a gain for the sites not a drain. The person buying the chips just contributed to the poker economy. If the money is in your account or the person buying the chips simply put it in there account it is money that's there that wasn't before.

I can never understand why anyone would place value on play money chips (as far as buying them goes). Why???

By you selling chips, you earn a profit from the individual buyer, or the player.

The poker room does not lose any money during this process.

Most likely, the buying player transfers the money on to your account.

You then most likely take that money and spend it on the poker room.

When you spend the money, the poker room receives a rake.

So in the end, the buying player loses money, you make money, you spend your money at the poker room, the poker room makes money.

I'm lost on this one?
Who pays real money for play money and why?

shiver said:

I'm lost on this one?
Who pays real money for play money and why?

Click to expand...

Alot of people are lost on this one and it's one of the great mysteries of life. Why pay when you can get them for free?

tpb221 said:

Alot of people are lost on this one and it's one of the great mysteries of life. Why pay when you can get them for free?

Click to expand...

People are lazy. How long does it take you to get 1,000,000 chips on stars?

They are willing to pay money instead of spend time. Seem pretty streight forward to me.

Why would someone pay to have their lawn mowed when they can do it them self for significantly less money?

Nexus6 said:

Hey so is that why I feel so safer playing mtts (not paying rake every hand I play) cause you and Snow seem to know that rake is a big part in this subject. Funny thing is I do very well in mtts . Then soon as I sit down at a ring game I get beat with my huge hands against other huge hands . So about my thinking that maybe the poker site would want to track people that are making money but have not put any of their real money of their own into their account that the poker site would pick ring games to watch those players who have not put in their own money in their account yet ?

Click to expand...

Everyone pays rake. It's how the sites make money. If you pay $11 for a tourny usually 10 goes to the prize pool and $1 to the site ... the $1 is the rake. The reason you do poorly in ring games is not because every hand is raked, its because there are different strategies in ring games than tournies.

Why would the site care where the money came from? Look at annette15, she built up thousands without depositing a dime.

When you win a pot in a ring game or cash in a tourny you are winning money that the other people most likely deposited, so its not like your printing money, it has to come from somewhere.

so by buying play chips for real money, you then change the whole concept by putting a value on them. but your using them against people who get them for free?

still lost.

bigjoker66 said:

Everyone pays rake. It's how the sites make money. If you pay $11 for a tourny usually 10 goes to the prize pool and $1 to the site ... the $1 is the rake. The reason you do poorly in ring games is not because every hand is raked, its because there are different strategies in ring games than tournies.

Why would the site care where the money came from? Look at annette15, she built up thousands without depositing a dime.

When you win a pot in a ring game or cash in a tourny you are winning money that the other people most likely deposited, so its not like your printing money, it has to come from somewhere.

Click to expand...

Awesome !!! Im sticking to mtts and sit n gos . Seems the site has less to do with my money and my opponents money I will save ring games for casino play .. Thanks for your time !!!

shiver said:

so by buying play chips for real money, you then change the whole concept by putting a value on them. but your using them against people who get them for free?

still lost.

Click to expand...

from what i been told by the honest site I been selling , my play chips for real money is that people buy play chips for a few reasons..

#1 and this was said on this thread , People loose their millions of play chips and are so addicted to playing the big play money tables (don't laugh lol) that they can't stand to start over at the small tables. So they rather pay money to get a couple of mill to get back to the big tables and to play the people they have been playing for along time.

#2 people that have bots need massive chips to test their bots out.

These are the 2 main reasons why..

tpb221 said:

Alot of people are lost on this one and it's one of the great mysteries of life. Why pay when you can get them for free?

Click to expand...

from what i been told by the honest site I been selling , my play chips for real money is that people buy play chips for a few reasons..

#1 and this was said on this thread , People loose their millions of play chips and are so addicted to playing the big play money tables (don't laugh lol) that they can't stand to start over at the small tables. So they rather pay money to get a couple of mill to get back to the big tables and to play the people they have been playing for along time.

#2 people that have bots need massive chips to test their bots out.

These are the 2 main reasons why..

Poker Orifice said:

I can never understand why anyone would place value on play money chips (as far as buying them goes). Why???

Click to expand...

from what i been told by the honest site I been selling , my play chips for real money is that people buy play chips for a few reasons..

#1 and this was said on this thread , People loose their millions of play chips and are so addicted to playing the big play money tables (don't laugh lol) that they can't stand to start over at the small tables. So they rather pay money to get a couple of mill to get back to the big tables and to play the people they have been playing for along time.

#2 people that have bots need massive chips to test their bots out.

These are the 2 main reasons why..

OzExorcist said:

Pretty sure it has zero effect.

The money got on the site somehow and it's staying on the site. The fact that it's in your account, not someone else's, and they gave it to you in exchange for nearly-worthless play money is irrelevant: the site still holds the exact same amount in deposits as they did before the exchange and they don't care who plays with the cash as long as someone is playing with it and paying rake / tournament fees when they do.

The business case for freerolls is a slightly different matter, basically the sites figure the amount they lose in freeroll prize money is worth it for the number of players that get drawn in by them - a lot of whom will get frustrated and just deposit their own money long before they manage to build an actual bankroll from freeroll winnings.

Click to expand...

thanks for your imput and i understand and agree with you and the others ..

Now About what you said here, "- a lot of whom will get frustrated and just deposit their own money long before they manage to build an actual bankroll from freeroll winnings.[/quote]

Is that Hearsay from you ? or your actuall expirience ? cause i saw the quote ?
I have talked with people that only play freerolls and never buy inn .. Ok maybe this is something that could possibly put some kind of negative feelings from the pokers sites about freerollers that never deposite and could lead to some kind of action taken towards those freerollers that never deposit. Could you give your thoughts on that OZ ? Thanks man for your time...

bazerk said:

As indicated by OzExorcist, providing freerolls = cost of doing business...the site will be able to write it off as an expense. Additionally, any monies players have on deposit with a site = liability to that site (it is not their money, it's the players' money) until a portion of it is earned via rake &/or tournament buy ins. Play chips = zero value >>> if someone is exchanging them for $$ chips, that transaction is outside the scope of the site since it is between individuals & has -0- impact on a site's financials (if that is the direction the ??? was leading?).

Click to expand...

very well said and easy to understand ... Thanks for your time , and thanks for being my facebook friend You have a great weekend sweety ...
Tony

Nexus6 said:

Is that Hearsay from you ? or your actuall expirience ? cause i saw the quote ?
I have talked with people that only play freerolls and never buy inn .. Ok maybe this is something that could possibly put some kind of negative feelings from the pokers sites about freerollers that never deposite and could lead to some kind of action taken towards those freerollers that never deposit. Could you give your thoughts on that OZ ? Thanks man for your time...

Click to expand...

I haven't got any figures backing it up if that's what you're asking but it stands to reason and I promise you it's what the poker sites are hoping the majority of freerollers will do. Or even better, they're hoping they'll win a little in the freerolls, get a taste for real money games and then deposit when they go busto because now that they've played real money they can't stand going back to the freerolls (just like the millionaire play money players, it seems).

As for "taking action" against freerollers that never deposit, I don't ever see that happening. If the site wasn't prepared to accept some level of freeloading they wouldn't have offered freerolls in the first place. And since they have offered them, what's the sense in pissing off people that could be potential real-money customers in the future and that are propping up the site's player stats in the short term?

OzExorcist said:

I haven't got any figures backing it up if that's what you're asking but it stands to reason and I promise you it's what the poker sites are hoping the majority of freerollers will do. Or even better, they're hoping they'll win a little in the freerolls, get a taste for real money games and then deposit when they go busto because now that they've played real money they can't stand going back to the freerolls (just like the millionaire play money players, it seems).

As for "taking action" against freerollers that never deposit, I don't ever see that happening. If the site wasn't prepared to accept some level of freeloading they wouldn't have offered freerolls in the first place. And since they have offered them, what's the sense in pissing off people that could be potential real-money customers in the future and that are propping up the site's player stats in the short term?

Click to expand...

well me and you see pissed of players all the time sooo... But I understand will never know lol... have a great weekend man .. Are you on the facebook cardschat ? I would like to add you if posssible ..

Poker Orifice said:

I can never understand why anyone would place value on play money chips (as far as buying them goes). Why???

Click to expand...

-Underaged kids wanting to play for money

-People thinking its easier to make money this way (but trust me these guys play serious)

-You can have multiple accounts with any madeup address

-Instant cashing out without any problems, most sites let you buy and sell with paypal/google checkout.

-No issues with your bank EVER.

..the list can go on I just can't remember now..

arty: