Losing streak after getting bonus?

Juniorsdaddy

Juniorsdaddy

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Total posts
746
Chips
0
For the second time, I have experience a sharp immediate losing streak after earning a bonus. I am curious if anyone else has experience this kind of problem, and what steps they took to correct it. The first time this happened it eventually cost me my entire bankroll, and I don't want it to happen again.

I find that I have been playing a little looser than I used to, but I don't think it explains it all. I don't keep track of stats long term, but my in-session stats seem similar in the early rounds. I have been betting more in later rounds, and I have been winning more non-showdown pots. But, my showdown win % has dropped from the 80s to about 50%. However, I don't play very many hands this far, so I don't think this is the problem either.

Any initial thoughts?
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2009
Total posts
1,319
Awards
1
Chips
35
Maybe it looks like a losing streak but it's not. for example, if i deposited 50 bucks and after releasing everything, when I end up with 75 dollars, then it means I should technically have 25 dollars since I got 50 dollars for free. It's hard to notice that you're losing when you're earning bonus unless you massively won from 50 dollars to 300 dollars and then started dropping back down after bonus. But I think I know what you're trying to say. That bonus does affect state of playing. Reminds me of how I went bust with first 200 dollars I deposited although i recovered all of that in the end thanks to cardschat.
 
Juniorsdaddy

Juniorsdaddy

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Total posts
746
Chips
0
The meltdown continued last night. However, after getting my bonus I am still up from where I started. I am going to post a couple of the hands that caused me grief, and maybe see if I could have played them differently. Time to make this a learning experience, I suppose.
 
N.D.

N.D.

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Total posts
930
Chips
0
You know, while earning a bonus you have to exercise an awful lot of discipline and self-control. It's very tough to earn a bonus of any sort and not lose half your money in the process(as first respondant mentioned).

Anyway, maybe it's more like you built up all this steam, and clearing the bonus sorta made you blow up a bit.

Oh yeah, try a different variant or lower/no stakes till it lets up. As long as you're still ahead, might as well let all that steam out in a safe way.
 
Juniorsdaddy

Juniorsdaddy

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Total posts
746
Chips
0
Thanks for the advice. I plan to take a couple of days off, and then hit low stakes, and maybe throw in a few SNGs/MTTs. I pretty much play cash, and I am sure that is part of the problem. The variance a cash game creats can be a bit hard to overcome sometimes.
 
soncheebs

soncheebs

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 9, 2009
Total posts
599
Chips
0
Thanks for the advice. I plan to take a couple of days off, and then hit low stakes, and maybe throw in a few SNGs/MTTs. I pretty much play cash, and I am sure that is part of the problem. The variance a cash game creats can be a bit hard to overcome sometimes.

idk about this, from what I've read and experienced there seems to be more variance in sit and go's. i don't have the data to support this but i'm sure someone on here can enlighten us all.
 
N.D.

N.D.

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Total posts
930
Chips
0
I don't think you're right about SNG's having higher variance. MTT's have higher variance. But I don't think the problem with SNG's is their variance, indeed if FTP had better rake on SNG's I'd probably just play those. 20c is still pretty steep.

Now with an SNG everyone starts with the same number of chips, this levels the playing field considerably when compared to a ring game. In an SNG you need only play a good 9 player game, slowly easing into 6 players, then push it to 3 players to get your money and a bit of change, from there it's just your best short handed game to make a bit more and best HU game to win it all.

You don't even have to win SNG's every time to do well in them. Just place at various places in the top 3 at least what, 55% of the time? And you're making a profit.

Ring games on the other hand offer better odds because you can leave at any time with your winnings. Double up, triple up, it's all up to you how much you sit with and how much you leave with. Can't do that with tournaments. Still, I feel like if ring games really had lower variance than SNG's it'd be a piece of cake to just sit and win 20x your buy-in and more without going bust.

Plus in ring games every cent you put in the pot's a real cent. You have to convince yourself it's just a chip or the money belongs to the game until you leave, but it's still real money.

Seriously, if there's a site where you have loot and they don't charge more than a dime in rake for SNG's, I suggest you work on your SNG game and build with it as much if not more often than your ring game. Also and this is just my opinion, ring games take more out of you than SNG's. SNG's are more like sprints while MTT's and ring games are more like marathons and cross country runs.
 
N.D.

N.D.

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Total posts
930
Chips
0
Hang on a second soncheebs. What kind of SNG's are you playing exactly? Turbos? Short stacks? Those do have increased variance, the same way a turbo or short stack MTT has increased variance.

It's all very complicated but as best I can figure, the higher the risk factor(such as the types of hands you have to shove with when short stacked or in a turbo), the higher the variance.
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2009
Total posts
1,319
Awards
1
Chips
35
Do you have rakeback? Rakeback definitely helps. It reduces your losses or makes you win more. If you're losing player, you'll break even. If you break even, you'll profit and become a rakeback pro. If you're a winning player, you get yourself extra bucks from the side. Consider getting a rakeback. It's like a hidden bonus.
 
Emperor IX

Emperor IX

Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Joined
May 28, 2007
Total posts
2,974
Chips
0
You say you're showdown win percentage dropped from 80 to 50? You aren't on a losing streak, you're just not still on your winning streak. 80% win at shwdown means you are folding too often in general and are probably bluffed too easily. ~50% is solid and sustainable
 
N.D.

N.D.

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Total posts
930
Chips
0
I think OP's talking about Take 2 which is at FTP. No way you can be a winning player by losing with their rakeback. Maybe at one of the 50% sites rakeback sites you could be a winning player by breaking even. I still don't get how you can be a winning player by losing with rakeback though. You just get 1/2 your rake back, not 1/2 your total $.

Jeeze I suck royally at math and either I'm worse than I thought, or there's actually someone who's worse than I am.
 
G

given68

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 18, 2009
Total posts
518
Awards
1
Chips
0
Well considering i didnt get mine till this morning i will have to see how i far out about a winning or losing streak starting later on tonight.
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2009
Total posts
1,319
Awards
1
Chips
35
You can't seriously believe this do you? :confused:



Snow :cool:

Dude, I'm not kidding. Rakeback does help a lot unless you're a wreckless player who loses very quickly. You can literally play cards, not people and make profit off rakeback. You can sit there like a rock all day and profit just through rakeback. I went to raketherake.com to sign up for doylesroom with 33% rakeback by depositing 30 bucks, made 150 bucks in a week, withdrew 140 bucks by paying 10 dollar processing fee and then got a check for 140 bucks which should be arriving about 5 days from now and 15 bucks of that money is from rakeback. I literally played 6 or more tables when I reached around 70 dollars. When I had 30, I played 1-2 tables, then 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, etc. i regret not having rakeback for full tilt.

Right now, I'm in a dilemma of whether I should deposit on pokerstars or not and if I do, if I should sign up using holdem manager site to get the program for free or sign up for rakeback on pokerstars and then use rakeback money to buy the program. Rakeback really works. Some members on this forum who have rakeback can tell you how beneficial it is to have a rakeback.
 
Snowmobiler

Snowmobiler

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 1, 2009
Total posts
2,644
Chips
0
pokerlovesme...

I think you played yourself. I could be wrong, but I'm under the impression you managed to actually work your butt off and still screw yourself out of money. W/O a matching bonus(you didn't mention a matching bonus no sir), I do believe you screwed yourself.

First you deposited 30 bucks and multiplied it by 5, so far so good, and you did it in a week, impressive, and still so far so good. Here's where you pretty much banged yourself senseless. You worked that hard, won $150




This may be the most confusing post Ive read :confused:

He made 500% on his bankroll in a week ($120 profit) and you are concerned about a 20% bonus on $30, that would egual $6.

Congrats pokerlovesme,very well done (even if you did play yourself ?)




Snow :cool:
 
StormRaven

StormRaven

Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Total posts
2,510
Chips
0
You can't get rakeback from pokerstars. Just sign up for the first time $600 bonus (depending on how much you have to deposit) or if you aren't depositing that much (less than $100) sign up through HEM and get the program for free.

Losing streak after getting bonus? Maybe. There's been a whole lot of people who will suddenly lose money after either cashing out a big win on a site or right after getting a bonus. Normally this happens because the player doesn't adjust their game properly. If cashing out they continue to play at levels before the cash out and in reality they should drop levels. If after bonus they are usually playing at too high of a level or are taking too many risks, getting cocky, because they now have extra cash. Chances are 1 of these 2 things has happened so I suggest you play like you did and at the levels you did before the bonus. If you are still losing, yes posting HH is a great idea, chances are you are making some mistakes you just don't see. GL
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2009
Total posts
1,319
Awards
1
Chips
35
This may be the most confusing post Ive read :confused:

He made 500% on his bankroll in a week ($120 profit) and you are concerned about a 20% bonus on $30, that would egual $6.

Congrats pokerlovesme,very well done (even if you did play yourself ?)




Snow :cool:

Sorry for confusing post. All I'm saying is, rakeback is like hidden bonus that you make from behind. It's like 3-4 cents every point if you're playing 9-handed ring game. I was on a roll and was literally playing cards, not people on doylesroom. On Full Tilt or live poker, I play people, not the cards. On doylesroom, I strictly play cards and play as if I'm playing with stocks. I was massive multi-tabling and it adds up. Even if you're not in a pot, you still get paid as long as you were dealt cards for full tilt and cake/doyles/playersonly. I definitely recommend rakeback. You can literally play like a rock, mostly fold, play super aggressive during pre-flop and come out with profit. So if you're break-even player, you make money through rakeback. Believe it or not, there are rakeback pros who make money just through rakeback. Some people have so many referrals as if they're in network marketing and make a lot even when they barely do anything.

And also, I didn't even release any of doylesroom 100% bonus yet. I was just constantly multi-tabling and made money through rakeback almost 15 dollars while I withdrew 150 bucks and got a check flying over to my house for 140 bucks. If I was a losing player, I would only lose 15 dollars instead of my whole deposit of 30 dollars. Do you get what I mean? Rakeback is a hidden bonus.
 
Last edited:
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

Legend
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2009
Total posts
1,319
Awards
1
Chips
35
You can't get rakeback from pokerstars. Just sign up for the first time $600 bonus (depending on how much you have to deposit) or if you aren't depositing that much (less than $100) sign up through HEM and get the program for free.

I have a question about pokerstars. Here is the site I use for rakeback for doylesroom. https://www.raketherake.com/PokerStars.html
Isn't that a rakeback but in different approach? I don't really understand their system or the benefit that they're offering for pokerstars through that site. But I will most likely take your advice and sign up through holdem manager program since I mostly play on full tilt and rakeback on pokerstars isn't much compared to other sites. I just wanted to say that if you have rakeback, it helps a lot. I got a rakeback of 15 dollars from multi-tabling. Since I deposited 30 bucks, if I was losing player, I would only lose 15 dollars instead of 30 bucks.
 
ean

ean

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 17, 2009
Total posts
171
Chips
0
For the second time, I have experience a sharp immediate losing streak after earning a bonus. I am curious if anyone else has experience this kind of problem, and what steps they took to correct it. The first time this happened it eventually cost me my entire bankroll, and I don't want it to happen again.
...
Any initial thoughts?

It might well be a good strategy to move on to playing another site for a while if you hit a downturn or just hit a bonus.

Regardless of whether you believe in "doomswitches" or even just "runs" of "flows" in the luck dynamic, it's sometimes a good play to just sit on your winnings or bonus money for a while, go back to playing other places for a while. Then lots of times the previous place sees you not playing and offers you another bonus, etc.
 
Juniorsdaddy

Juniorsdaddy

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Total posts
746
Chips
0
It might well be a good strategy to move on to playing another site for a while if you hit a downturn or just hit a bonus.

Regardless of whether you believe in "doomswitches" or even just "runs" of "flows" in the luck dynamic, it's sometimes a good play to just sit on your winnings or bonus money for a while, go back to playing other places for a while. Then lots of times the previous place sees you not playing and offers you another bonus, etc.

Actually, this has happened to me at two different sites. But, I am not one of those "the site is out to get me" people. I really think I made some boo-boos and need to learn from those the next time I fall into some more cash. Haven't played in a couple of days, so I should hit the tables again fresh.
 
sld2

sld2

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Total posts
152
Chips
0
Earning my bonus first has always been my problem. :)
 
M

Madness_does

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 26, 2007
Total posts
425
Chips
0
I feel the same way, I just won over 11,000 points on full tilt, went on tilt and said hell with it, now I cant win jack, its not that I have changed my game, matter of fact I tightened up my game, but river after river runner runner, gets a little disgusting after a while, hell I did good on cards chat free roll this last week and came in 4th place, but I have already lost 3 dollars of it, I either dont get any cards or I get burned on the river. so goes poker, oops I mean so goes online poker.
 
L

luckforsome

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
Total posts
237
Chips
0
...I kinda am the same..i got 25 dollars free on ft from the take 2 competition...generally im real tight and selective in my choice of games..but since its free, Im kinda pisssing about with it playing stupid stakes..taking the weekend off now, just to relax and nnot blow the rest of my BR
 
StormRaven

StormRaven

Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Total posts
2,510
Chips
0
I have a question about pokerstars. Here is the site I use for rakeback for doylesroom. https://www.raketherake.com/PokerStars.html
Isn't that a rakeback but in different approach? I don't really understand their system or the benefit that they're offering for pokerstars through that site. But I will most likely take your advice and sign up through holdem manager program since I mostly play on full tilt and rakeback on pokerstars isn't much compared to other sites. I just wanted to say that if you have rakeback, it helps a lot. I got a rakeback of 15 dollars from multi-tabling. Since I deposited 30 bucks, if I was losing player, I would only lose 15 dollars instead of 30 bucks.

Pokerstars does not participate in rakeback, instead they have the best points program on the web. Signing up through the raketherake site only offers you a freeroll deal. There are a ton of freerolls for money daily plus specials worth a lot more on a regular basis, you just have to look for them. If you sign up with Pokerstars through HEM you get HEM free with a deposit (I don't recall how much) but it really depends on how much you are depositing. Pokerstars offers a $600 first time sign up bonus if you do it on your own, look at their site for the bonus code before depositing. If you are not going to be depositing that much, like less than $100 then you are better off signing up with HEM. If you are depositing more than $100 then you are better off doing the first time bonus of up to $600. GL!
 
moemtg

moemtg

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 20, 2009
Total posts
529
Chips
0
Funny you should say so...

I just recieved the Take 2 money ($50) promotional that Full Tilt ran in September.... and I swear to god its like pulling teeth to gain any money out of it... I'm using proper bankroll mngmt... and everything else... but I'll be damned if my aces arent cracked by a low baller donkey straight and straight beat by straight flushes... and other crazy crap.

I sometimes wonder about full tilt.

My two cents,
Moe:cool:
 
Top