Limping in micro stakes

I've been playing $2 cash games for a few weeks now and at the moment I can't beat them, It seems very rare that bluffs work or even just c bets which makes playing difficult unless you hit the flop, so i'm wondering will it be effective to limp in for more hands because if you hit you are more likely to get paid off because people just don't seem to fold as much? or is limping just nearly always bad?

Forget about bluffing in the micros and the same goes to some extent for non value Cbets.
Those tend to be more effective against thinking players.
Most of the fish in the micros are going to call you to the river with Ace high or bottom pair and figure they have got the best hand.
That's why they call it NoFoldem Holdem.
Your best bet is just to play ABC poker.
Raise with your good hands preflop and bet down for value when you connect with the flop.

PokerDoctor said:

Forget about bluffing in the micros and the same goes to some extent for non value Cbets.
Those tend to be more effective against thinking players.
Most of the fish in the micros are going to call you to the river with Ace high or bottom pair and figure they have got the best hand.
That's why they call it NoFoldem Holdem.
Your best bet is just to play ABC poker.
Raise with your good hands preflop and bet down for value when you connect with the flop.

Click to expand...

ya, what he said.
but in micros, if you get a hand you dont think you can fold, shove! they will call wayyyy often, even if you get sucked out on, reload, do it again.

Ive found that the micro games are like freerolls. People dont mind losing a few bucks and will chase alot more.

Thanks for the advice, I'll take it from this that I shouldn't be limping, also How should I be playing small pocket pairs in EP? because at the moment I'm raising and then just folding the flop the majority of the time

If you aren't used to play them there fold them PF

IcedBoar said:

How should I be playing small pocket pairs in EP? because at the moment I'm raising and then just folding the flop the majority of the time

Click to expand...

They're not raising hands in EP. If you're at a table that usually lets you see the flop and where there are stacks large enough to give you enough implied odds, you can limp to set mine. You should expect to miss and fold about 7 times out of 8. But simply folding pre- is fine too.

Some of this is totally wrong. C-bets work more at 2nl than any other limit in my experience, infact if you filtered your cbet success per limit over a good sample i would bet my bankroll that this is the case. If a guy doesn't fold to c-bets then stop c-bet bluffing and go only for value, note that in this case, A high with a backdoor flushdraw and an overcard, or third pair... IS a value c-bet when people arent folding to them.

acky100 said:

Some of this is totally wrong. C-bets work more at 2nl than any other limit in my experience, infact if you filtered your cbet success per limit over a good sample i would bet my bankroll that this is the case. If a guy doesn't fold to c-bets then stop c-bet bluffing and go only for value, note that in this case, A high with a backdoor flushdraw and an overcard, or third pair... IS a value c-bet when people arent folding to them.

Click to expand...

Agree with this,

As for limping small PP in EP. Just fold them, limping should only be used in rare circumstances. But at the microstakes I would advise not ever limping.

acky100 said:

Some of this is totally wrong. C-bets work more at 2nl than any other limit in my experience, infact if you filtered your cbet success per limit over a good sample i would bet my bankroll that this is the case. If a guy doesn't fold to c-bets then stop c-bet bluffing and go only for value, note that in this case, A high with a backdoor flushdraw and an overcard, or third pair... IS a value c-bet when people arent folding to them.

Click to expand...

I agree 100 % w/ this^....and im not sure if anyone has said this already but from what ive read/learned you should never open limp, but you should limp if enough people before you have already limped. EX. Hero has 82o in late position and he has 6 limpers in front of him. I could be wrong but i believe you should also limp in this spot because of your odds, even though you have shit cards.

sbialcza said:

I agree 100 % w/ this^....and im not sure if anyone has said this already but from what ive read/learned you should never open limp, but you should limp if enough people before you have already limped. EX. Hero has 82o in late position and he has 6 limpers in front of him. I could be wrong but i believe you should also limp in this spot because of your odds, even though you have shit cards.

Click to expand...

82o?? really?? Just fold.. Youre getting odds into what? Say youre getting 7/1 cos of the limpers you can garauntee 82o does not have a 7/1 chance of being the winning hand. Also take into account you cant be confident even if you flop TP. Even if it was a marginal hand its still not worth it, just an increase in variance.

If you have 6 limpers in front of you with any decent hand.............. SQUEEZE! Easy money.

IcedBoar said:

I've been playing $2 cash games for a few weeks now and at the moment I can't beat them, It seems very rare that bluffs work or even just c bets which makes playing difficult unless you hit the flop, so i'm wondering will it be effective to limp in for more hands because if you hit you are more likely to get paid off because people just don't seem to fold as much? or is limping just nearly always bad?

Click to expand...

You dont need to hit to make money.

Isolating and open raising will make significantly more money than anything else you do. The biggest money making factor in poker is initiative.

Also raise bigger. My standard raise at 2nl is 4x. My iso size varies between 4x-6x.

Cbet half pot when bluffing and near pot for value. No one will notice and no one will adjust.

Raise/iso + cbet = lots of bbs.

The only time i open limp is when i misclick.

At micro stakes C-bets are usually a poor play because people will just call them down. C-bets at micro stakes can almost wipe out the profit from good tight-aggressive play

youregoodmate said:

82o?? really?? Just fold.. Youre getting odds into what? Say youre getting 7/1 cos of the limpers you can garauntee 82o does not have a 7/1 chance of being the winning hand. Also take into account you cant be confident even if you flop TP. Even if it was a marginal hand its still not worth it, just an increase in variance.

If you have 6 limpers in front of you with any decent hand.............. SQUEEZE! Easy money.

Click to expand...

So true. Having more people ahead of you just means that your hand (82o) is even more likely to get beat, even if you manage a 2 pair. Hands that are likely to be more profitable with more players and larger pots are hands like suited connectors, because if you do hit you are very likely to have the best hand (reverse implied odds)

C-bets at 4nl are still profitable for me. And cbetting 3 bet pots is very +ev. Bet smaller if you need to. Turn cbets are not so nice, even when the scary card comes. They're usually gonna see a river if they don't fold to the flop.

Thanks for the replys, I've also noticed that I tend to lose money when people min raise and can't seem to fold to them,
For example just now:
I raise with AKo UTG to $0.08(2nl)
Button calls everyone else folds, (0.19 pot)
Flop: A T 9 (rainbow)
I bet 0.14, button calls,
Turn (0.45): A T 9 7 (all 4 suits on board)
i bet $0.30, button raises to $0.60, i move all in ($2) he calls (he has 10 7)

LOL THATS PRETTY MUCH THE WHY IT GOES IN MICROS LOL!!!!!!:banghead:

Play ABC poker until you have solid 'reads', then adjust to each player.
Everybody plays differently and you need to 'suss out' their strategy (or if they have a strategy).
Usually playing TAG, ABC poker is the way to go in micro, although LAG can be good with a timid table.
Open limping, Imo, is not good, (raise or fold) unless you have a premium hand and you think someone will raise, then you can 3bet for value.
Bet big for value with the nuts or near nuts.
For set mining with small PP you want implied odds of about 15/1 or above.
Just my 2cents.
Good luck.

I have a cbet of 72% and success (when they fold) of 50% at 2nl on stars. I bet big for value and half pot as bluff. Its incredibly profitable.

Thanks for the replys, I've also noticed that I tend to lose money when people min raise and can't seem to fold to them,

Click to expand...

Whenever you get raised, your default should be fold. You need a good reason to keep going with the hand.

Some reasons are :
-you have a strong redraw and you have implied odds
-villain has shown he is capable of raising as a bluff often enough or he has raised top pair before and you have better.

But as a default just fold. Folding is one of the strongest plays in poker and probably one of the biggest problems players have; they dont fold enough.

I dont agree with limping on 82o, but limping with connectors or at worse Q8o should be an easy limp. More importantly you need to have good reads on the peps at the table. So after 20 minutes you can really open up your game

dooydoo said:

I have a cbet of 72% and success (when they fold) of 50% at 2nl on stars. I bet big for value and half pot as bluff. Its incredibly profitable.



Whenever you get raised, your default should be fold. You need a good reason to keep going with the hand.

Some reasons are :
-you have a strong redraw and you have implied odds
-villain has shown he is capable of raising as a bluff often enough or he has raised top pair before and you have better.

But as a default just fold. Folding is one of the strongest plays in poker and probably one of the biggest problems players have; they don't fold enough.

Click to expand...

I agree. Learn to fold.

Micro Stakes

I remember when I first started my bankroll at Aced by playing points buy in freerolls and every time I got a few dollars I would got to the micro tables to try and double up. Well like you, nothing worked because you can't bluff and even if you are not bluffing it is hard to move players out of a hand playing low stakes. So most of the time I came out a loser. After I found out I wasn't going to win, I just waited until I had enough money to move up and i started to win a few pots.