How much should I lose

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puke

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I played low limit texas-holdem one year ago. I am really frustrated and stop play after a big loss. It seems I have no hope to win.
I was told by books that I should only play good hands than I can beat loose players. I tried that but the situation is different. There are so many loose players there playing very bad hands. After I give up some SB and BB, I finally got one good hand. I am in, I know I have high probability to beat one loose player. But how about three there,that is three times more probability. A lot of time I was beaten by one of them. Combining some other normal loss, I found really have no hope to break even.

Now I am trying to start again. But I am really afraid. Can anyone tell me how much should I lose before I can break even. Or should I switch to play no limit holdem. I know most of people here play that. There should be better books to follow, right?
 
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Tangerine 53

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There's no real answer to your question on how much you should lose other than what you can afford. Practise solid bankroll management and don't stretch yourslef too much financially. Learn the game through study, reading books (try Phil Gordon's Little Green Book), reading and contributing to this forum and play solid ABC poker.
 
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Pafkata

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live limit holdem is like roulette, I doubt if anyone can beat such game for more than 1-2 BB per hour... You have a more reasonable chance to win if you bet on 'red' :D

No limit is the game involving most skill,but if you are bad - you will lose much much more.. and unbelievably quickly...
 
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puke

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Thank you for your advice. Little Green Book seems to be for no limit holdem. I only play fixed low limit holdem. That is why I am considering switch to it.


Tangerine 53 said:
There's no real answer to your question on how much you should lose other than what you can afford. Practise solid bankroll management and don't stretch yourslef too much financially. Learn the game through study, reading books (try Phil Gordon's Little Green Book), reading and contributing to this forum and play solid ABC poker.
Click to expand...
 
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puke

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Yeah, that is what I mean, though I do not know what "red" is.
Actually I just hope I am familiar with holdem by playing limit holdem. Then I can switch to no limit. It is just I became more and more unconfident by play that game.

Pafkata said:
live limit holdem is like roulette, I doubt if anyone can beat such game for more than 1-2 BB per hour... You have a more reasonable chance to win if you bet on 'red' :D

No limit is the game involving most skill,but if you are bad - you will lose much much more.. and unbelievably quickly...
Click to expand...
 
The Gent

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Hi Puke

I have played a lot of low stakes Limit Holdem, particularly on NoIQ poker when I was working an offer that gave free Holdem Manger for getting an amount of VP points.

I used Phil Hellmuth's book 'Play Poker Like the Pros', it has a basic strategy involving Top 10 hands to play and goes into player characteristics. The book itself is basic, but it worked well for me.

I ended up making a profit and got the software free so win, win.

I would suggest that you think less of what you are going to win/lose and more about improving your game. Taking every 'good' hand to the river will be exploitable.

an example of the hands is here

Good Luck
 
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RVladimiro

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I don't play no limit hold'em because the pot odds to chase a draw are usually good for the typical player. I think someone called it "no fold'em". Can't really help you with what to do with no limit to be honest, but improving your game and knowing when to fold is the fastest way to at least break even.

Regarding how much should you loose... tough question. Depends on how big of a bankroll you can support. Don't feed your bankroll of your own money if you find yourself not being able to improve your game to the point of making money, villains money.

If you don't know bankroll management, I stronly advise you to watch this:

http://academy.fulltiltpoker.com/lessons/video/52/bankroll-management

Good luck and have fun
 
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tcummo

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limit holdem has less variance than no limit.
it is a more 'mechanical' game
i.e there are usually odds to chase a draw.
if you want to try no limit i would advise you to play
some freerolls to get a 'feel' for the game.
try different styles like:
'TAG' (tight/aggressive)
'LAG' (loose/aggressive)
MANIAC (extremely aggressive) etc.
review your hands to try and find your mistakes.(and WHY you made
that mistake).
don't worry about results.
read,study and THINK about the game.
rail good players and try to see the thinking behind the plays.
practice good BR management.
ask questions here (cardschat)
enjoy the game.
good luck.
 
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fugitive67

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you might be trying to apply what you learned in the books too literally

the books are a solid place to start, but you have to start seeing things ... that light bulb has to go off and you will see opportunities that you are probably missing now ... it's amazing how much stealing a few pots can do for your stack and either prevent you from getting short stacked or at least giving you more chips to double up with when you get to that fold or all in point
 
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only_bridge

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baudib1 said:
[ ] understands variance
Click to expand...
Lol, my major is mathematics.
I probably read more statistics at university than anyone else on this site.
Let me give you a simple example so you can understand.
Lets say you have two tourneys, with equal structure, and the same number of participants. One being limit and the other beeing no limit.
Which one do you think will end first?
 
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puke

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That is great. I will check that book. Is Holdem Manger a software for hand history and give your advice. I probably will get one. I know there are some softwares there. Do I need to use several together or one has already covered all.

The Gent said:
Hi Puke

I have played a lot of low stakes Limit Holdem, particularly on NoIQ poker when I was working an offer that gave free Holdem Manger for getting an amount of VP points.

I used Phil Hellmuth's book 'Play Poker Like the Pros', it has a basic strategy involving Top 10 hands to play and goes into player characteristics. The book itself is basic, but it worked well for me.

I ended up making a profit and got the software free so win, win.

I would suggest that you think less of what you are going to win/lose and more about improving your game. Taking every 'good' hand to the river will be exploitable.

an example of the hands is here

Good Luck
Click to expand...
 
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Poker Orifice

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only_bridge said:
Lol, my major is mathematics.
I probably read more statistics at university than anyone else on this site.
Let me give you a simple example so you can understand.
Lets say you have two tourneys, with equal structure, and the same number of participants. One being limit and the other beeing no limit.
Which one do you think will end first?
Click to expand...
"It depends" lol
 
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RamdeeBen

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only_bridge said:
True [ ]
False [X]
Click to expand...


Varience in limit poker is indeed a hell of a lot more.

People get the odds every single time to call for their draws/gut shots/sets/two pairs and everything else.

Therefore, it has more varience. Sure the swings might not be as bad, but it's no easy game limit, very frustrating game and near impossible to get anyone of ANY sort of hand.
 
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RamdeeBen

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only_bridge said:
Lol, my major is mathematics.
I probably read more statistics at university than anyone else on this site.
Let me give you a simple example so you can understand.
Lets say you have two tourneys, with equal structure, and the same number of participants. One being limit and the other beeing no limit.
Which one do you think will end first?
Click to expand...

That's irrelevant though and doesn't base anything on varience just because no limit would end quicker than a limit game.

This is because people can't bet more (go all-in) in limit so it would be slower for everyones stacks to dwindle.

Now, as for variance, you have Aces 100 times in limit and 100 times in no limit. Which one is more is likely to take down pots on the flop/turn/river more often than not? No limit of course, in limit, someone will call down with any draw down to the river, meaning chances are they are more likely to hit because they wouldn't of bailed out earlier because of pots odds therefore limit has more variance.

The only difference is, you can't really bust yourself as quick in the limit game.
 
The Gent

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I am not sure if you need HEM yet, I suggest looking at offers etc if you feel you need software.

I had no cash apart from a small amount in my roll so made sense if I was playing to play for the software. I have no idea what the current offers are if any as it is about 2 years ago that I did this, perhaps longer.

Good luck though :)
 
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Ambers Advice

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It really depends how much money you have, and how much of that you are willing to dedicate to the game.
Just sit down and think how much you enjoy the game, and how much that is worth to you.
Then you will have your answer.

_________________________________________
Ambers Advice @ http://bit.ly/GrahamGameOn247
 
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only_bridge

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To answer the OP.
In lowstakes limit the rake is murder.
And no limit holdem is so much bigger.
Therefor I think it would be much easier to be successful if you switch to no limit.
 
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only_bridge

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Wow, u went to school with Gauss, you must be really old. :p
 
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nightmoves44

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!!

Maybe moving to higher stakes tend to stop alot of donkness,so you might try that.Never play with money you arent willing to lose.Dont play with your bill money!
One big difference from the pros and the rest of us..they can lose $50,000 in a hand and not blink an eye...so dont let losing..or winning go to your head.
 
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Pafkata

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variance

only_bridge said:
Lol, my major is mathematics.
I probably read more statistics at university than anyone else on this site.
Let me give you a simple example so you can understand.
Lets say you have two tourneys, with equal structure, and the same number of participants. One being limit and the other beeing no limit.
Which one do you think will end first?
Click to expand...

You should think more than read :)

Losing or winning big in no limit does not mean that the game has bigger variance.

Limit holdem is actually very high variance and that's why no one really wins or loses big. The very high variance lowers the skill edges, so everyone is about break-even or losing because of the rake. casinos love high variance games because everyone has fun and plays every hand and finally the only winner is the house via rake.

No limit holdem allows you to win a lot with the best hand and lose virtually nothing when you don't hit the flop. If you are bad - you will lose a lot quickly , but variance is not the reason - it's the skill.

You can check out this math:

Let's say you play 1000 no limit hands on 6 max tables for a day
You will be posting blinds for 166 orbits x 1.5BB per orbit = 249BB
You will be dealt on average 5 times AA and 5 times KK. It's very unlikely that you don't win more than 250BB with those monsters only and finish the session as a winner, but most players will finish as losers because they will play a lot of hands and they will play them bad.... Even a complete nit who plays only AA and KK can be one 100BB stack winner for 1K hands on micro stakes. It's all skill , cards do not matter.
 
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