Does every poker player think he/she can play pro??

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nick007

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Yeah I was just wondering if every serious poker player thinks they can play professionally, or is it just me? I mean with the right bankroll it seems that any solid player can make it. What makes the pros so much different from the above average players? what tools do they have that I don't? Don't really expect answers to the last two, just thinking out loud. Any insight would be nice though. PEACE
 
bob_tiger

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hmm intersting question. I really dont think i could play poker for my regular job, but to if you ever wanted to play poker for a job i would suggest starting with a br like at 5k and you will probably need to be very good at high buy in tourneys and sit n gos. I really dont think i could do it because i do it for fun but i do think im a good player and i have played a pro in a tourney once on full tilt and i took a nice pot from him. ( he wasnt one of those famous guys but was a pro), but then again it was online and i believe i had a full house against his flush. i had full house on the flop and he was chasing a flush. I made a good read on him and let him hit his flush and took a nice pot from him, so I think i made a nice play. I also dont think i could become a pro because i might lose my br if i get drunk because i wouldnt know when to stop.
 
bob_tiger

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oh and one more thing, I think its very hard to play poker for a living because of the up and downs you get.
 
Chiefer

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i think that there are many players on here that have the skills to play pro. i do not. take the wsop for example. if i played one, i feel that i could hold my own for awhile, probably get lucky enough to get close to the bubble posibly even cash if i got really lucky. matt damon said it best in rounders, it doesn't really apply today since every accountant in the world feels they can play and one usually gets lucky, but, "there is a reason that the same nine players are at the final table every year. because it's a skill game." thier skill is far greater than mine and they would eat me alive.
 
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nick007

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i agree with u 100% I'm not a real big online player. whats the excitement of sitting your house? I'd much rather be out at a cardroom interacting with ppl. My question was referring to live action, i didnt specify.
 
bob_tiger

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to play pro trying to do so online is not the way to go if you are serious about being pro get off your rump and hit the tournament circuits if that is what you want or go play high dollar cash games high enough to make a good living

so yes you would have to play both live and online. make some extra money online and make most of your money live.
 
Wolfpack43ACC

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move to an area around a casino #1. if i were to go pro I'd move towards syracuse for turning stone, since I'm only 20. A mix of online and live of course. Does anyone actually know someone who has gone pro? I know of someone thru a friend who did, even played in a tournament at the play boy mansion. Apparently he makes a good living.
 
TN Fireman

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After keeping track of the WSOP this year, I realize that the pros lose more than I thought. If you wanted to go pro, you would have to be pretty confident that you could sustain $10,000 losses, much like Chris Ferguson, Annie Duke, Phil Helmuth, Phil Ivey, Daniel Negraneu <sp?> and many other pros did when they finished outside the money this year.

How willing are you to take those kind of beats?
 
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amberturner1

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Like said, be prepared for the ups and downs. The main thing I have learned 1st hand is when you win big, don't blow it :) Keep your game tight, learn from your mistakes, and don't get cocky.
 
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lesclaypool6

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You have to remember... if you're going to be a professional poker player, it doesn't just require having a positive bankroll. Think of your job now... most of the money you earn gets spent just for everyday living. You'd have to play and earn enough that you have the bankroll to not only up your buy-ins and limits over time, but to actually pay your bills every month.

I think I can safely make the assumption that most CC'ers' bankrolls are not the same as their bank accounts. It would make our poker "careers" a LOT different if they were.
 
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MississippiMud

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Poker players are like fisherman... need I say more.
 
reglardave

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The realit of the situatiomn as I see it is this; the real "pros", the people who make their living from playing poker, are by and large not the players you see in the TV tournaments. They're to be found in AC, or Vegas, or at Turning Stone for example, sitting in the poker rooms all day most every day, grinding it out at the high stakes tables. And it is a grind; you got living expenses, variance issues, and many other factors to deal with. BR management is hugely important to these people.

Let's face it; the players whose faces you see on the tube alla time are for the most part sponsored, staked, or otherwise subsidized. And many of them are also deeply in debt. Look at Matusow for a prime example. In 2005, he cashed for more than 1.5M, in fact almost 2M at the WSOP in the summer, and was bankrupt in October. When he guested on this years ME coverage with Phil Gordon, a request went out to the gasllery for a show of hands of people he owed money, and easily 2/3 of the room had 'em up. And Mike had a good showing at the WSOP this year, too, relatively.

At the levels/buying of WSOP/WPT/EPT and so on events, very few of these guys could last it out without the corporate sponsors, the TV contracts, the book deals and appearance fees. And those who do, you'll fiind at the big casino high stakes tables nearly everyday, grinding it out. It's a tough way to make an easy living.
 
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TurnipHead

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Yeah I was just wondering if every serious poker player thinks they can play professionally, or is it just me?

No, every serious poker player would LOVE to play professionally, but MOST serious poker players realise that the swings will do you in.

What makes the pros so much different from the above average players? what tools do they have that I don't?

What makes them different? As noted, huge sponsorship deals through TV and online poker sites.

What tools do they have that (we) don't? They (usually) had big bankrolls when they started out and/or hit the coinflips 4, 5 or 6 times in a row in the MAJOR MTT tournies to set them on the road in the first place.

Yes, I've had a bad day at the tables.
 
Thewebmaster

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Online is one way to go

Hi all,
This is an interesting thread, I have to disagree that online poker isn't the way to go. If your thinking of starting out as a pro online poker is definitely the way to start at least. With most large poker rooms offering tournaments up to and above $100,000 $200,000 and even $1,000,000
You also don't have the added expense of travelling far and wide looking for the big buck tourneys,extra clothing,food,drink etc...(which you would pay more for than if you were at home). Also you can play for longer if your online, you don't have to put up with comments from other players if you don't want, you can concentrate more with the game online.

The hardest part is starting with a big enough bankroll as mentioned, playing poker professionally people automatically think of WSOP stars/winners but playing poker professionally just means you make a living at it, which if you have the bankroll and are a decent enough player and your living expenses aren't too excessive isn't that hard.

There are many players even here at cardschat who easily have the capability to play for a living, if they don't they usually choose not to or they lack the confidence but you don't have to play pro's to be a pro.
Most players earning a living online are just playing sit-n-gos with the odd MTT, sit-n-go's with 6 people your generally looking at around $50 - $100 buy-in+ sit-n-go's with 10 people probably around $25 - $50+ buy-in. If you can consistently come in the money that would be generally enough to earn a living. It obviously depends on what you need to live on, most small families could get by on around $2,000 per month, from posts you've read here at cardschat you know that to be fairly easily achieved by some players. The problems usually come when you decide you want more to live on and enter more expensive tourneys, moving up in the money to much higher buy-ins results in a different type of player and if you don't get used to that change quickly can result in some big losses.

Just some of my views, great thread though

Tony :)
 
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pro's make a lot of money in thoes tournaments you never hear about, between pro's. Pros vs. novices in big tournaments end up bad for the pro's in my opinion because novices make bad moves. 'When a pro knows they made a mistake and trys to max out the money from that mistake (which is how money's made in poker) the novice get's lucky. I know when I play people who rarely ever play poker and take it very lightly, its hard because you may not give them pot odds, you might play like you have the flush, or you might play two pair hard (when you should) but those donkies (as their called here it seems) still go in and get lucky or bust your really good bluff because they dont notice what's really happening or think about the whole picture. Plus a pro probably finds it hard to beat out a novice on a hot card streak because, as many people on here know, the first step towards getting good at this game is knowing when to lay down AK or good hands like it. A novice will hang on, and sometimes gets lucky because of it, thus a pro really can't force a novice off what he thinks is a good starting hand even post-flop, which could be anything from AA to A-rag offsuit!

I think, no no i KNOW, a pro could beat me consistently, or 99 times out of 100, but I know every now and then I'd win 1 just based on luck. Pro's just know how to play you, and only lucky cards can bail you out I think until you get to a certain skill level. And if I ever won once against a pro in a tournament, i'd call it a lucky break and hope to hell i'd never face them in a tournament again!

In WSOP there are always a looooooot of new players, and it's like pro's or even just good players are running through a mine field to get to the final table, or hell even just the money cut. All it takes is one or more novices to make a stupid mistake that luck rewards with a big hit, and to me that's my kryptonite. I go on tilt fast and hard when a player i know is playing wrong gets rewarded to my expense due to luck
 
ripptyde

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hmm intersting question. I really dont think i could play poker for my regular job, but to if you ever wanted to play poker for a job i would suggest starting with a br like at 5k and you will probably need to be very good at high buy in tourneys and sit n gos. I really dont think i could do it because i do it for fun but i do think im a good player and i have played a pro in a tourney once on full tilt and i took a nice pot from him. ( he wasnt one of those famous guys but was a pro), but then again it was online and i believe i had a full house against his flush. i had full house on the flop and he was chasing a flush. I made a good read on him and let him hit his flush and took a nice pot from him, so I think i made a nice play. I also dont think i could become a pro because i might lose my br if i get drunk because i wouldnt know when to stop.

LoL

::SFTrue
 
Thewebmaster

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Hi Drizzt

Hi all,
Drizzt you make some good points in your post but you'll find a lot of the novices your speaking of in the lower limit tourneys. One of the plans of playing sit-n-go tourneys is to play many of the same players at a particular level. When I was playing many many sit-n-go's at pacific at the $10+ level many of the players I recognized, I kept notes on the ones which played almost identical every tournament (which is a huge help), at these levels you don't see many idiot players although there are a few exceptions (at any level).
Many of the players in these sit-n-go's don't necessarily play for a living but they may win or take second place once in a while which keeps them playing at that level when in fact they should be settling back into lower buy-in tourney's. You have to do a bit of research on the tables your planning on playing, take notes, try and play the regulars so you know how they play, watch for the ones who seem to always go out 3rd or 4th and occasionally hit the money, these are good players to go against because they are convinced sooner or later they will take 1st place (sometimes they will). Also watch for the players who seem to take 1st or 2nd most games, they are the ones you don't really want to battle with, no point while there are easier players, not idiots, just easier players.

oluaris if you want to go pro it's not really a straight forward decision, i've been wanting to play pro for many years but different things get in the way, family, work,timing, i've played pro for a while but it's a misleading thing saying that, i've made a living playing poker for a while sounds better as pro gives a wrong impression I think, it leads people to believe that you think your better than everyone else or you win major tourneys when that simply isn't the case. You just have to have a go at winning some tourney's or sit-n-go's starting at lower limit buy-ins and work your way up, if you win consistently at say $2 buy-ins then try $5 buy-ins and lose most of the time then drop back to $2 buy-ins until you get better and build your bankroll.
One thing, don't sell yourself short, a lot of good players don't think they are good enough, i've seen people playing freerolls who shouldn't be, they should be playing real money tourneys but for one reason or another they don't. The bankroll is important too, you will get losing streaks so a safe bankroll is about 50 times your buy-in (some say 100 or more). That means that if your starting to play $1 tourneys/sitngos about $50 should be enough, $10 buy-ins you should have at least $500, let's face it if your going to lose 50 tourneys in a row then you definitely aren't ready.

Just my thoughts :)

Tony:)
 
Wolfpack43ACC

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It's really about bankroll management. People don't do it right. This is a make money fast era in America. We see the guys on tv at final tables year after year making the big money in these poker tournaments without realizing how hard it actually is. The real pros are the ones grinding it away at the cash game tables, some you've probably never even heard of.
 
Crummy

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To go pro in poker is a hard, just because you win an event or make $100,000,000+ in a tournament dosen't mean you are a pro. I tell my wife all of the time that I want to sell the business and play poker for the rest of my life. I also tell her the only way I would do this is if I won more than $2,000,000. Anything less and it would still be a hobby, or a second job you could say. To be 100% honest I don't think I would ever play professionaly without having something to fall back on. Right now I own a business and even if I would win millions tommorow I would still own my business. Chances are I would hire a few more people to do most of the work and work on new projects, and start another business up. I'm the type of guy that I have to have something going on, or I get bored and thats not fun.

Even if I made it to the point that I could sell my business and play poker, I have a masters degree that I will fall back on.

Don't get me wrong I would play poker every chance I got, any tournament I could play in I would, but I would still have things going, and build my business.

Take John Juanda for example. Yes he is a professional poker player, but go into his new resturant today and you will see him answering the phones, server tables and taking orders.
 
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young_chucho

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I thought i had what it takes to become a
pro but then, i realized that i have one
major hole in my game..... I fn suck
 
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