Clarification on proper tourney/SnG terminology

dmorris68

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This is probably just a hair-splitting semantic question, but my uncertainty has been bugging me for awhile so I'm seeking clarification.

When talking about MTT's, does that also include multi-table SnG's, and when talking about SnG's, does that imply single-table SnG's? Most books I see go out of their way to define a SnG as a single-table affair. And it makes sense to equate a multi-player SnG with a MTT since it's the same thing only unscheduled, though with typically smaller fields than most true MTTs.

I ask because while analyzing stats (ROI and ITM%, specifically) the thresholds for success are very different between 9-player SnGs and MTT's. It is said that 15-20% ITM is considered good for MTT's, while >40% is considered good for single-table SnG's.

I rarely play single-table SnG's, but often play 45 or 90 player SnG's, sometimes 180's. Occasionally an 18 or 27, but not as often as the larger ones. And I mix in a few MTT's here and there. So should I be primarily concerning myself with MTT numbers, perhaps adjusting them slightly for the smaller fields, or what?
 
absoluthamm

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I think a lot of it is based on personal preference. Technically, a Multi-Table SNG is a MTT, but it is obviously also a SNG. What you left out was the STT(Single Table Tourney), and that is what the traditional SNG that you are talking about is. They are both SNGs, just one is MTT and one is STT, but the majority of the time when someone is talking about an SNG, it is of the STT kind. Hope that helped clarify some things
 
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SNG's are single or multi-table tournaments that start when a specific number of players have registered.

MTT's are multi-table tournaments that start at a specified time regardless of the number of entrants. (There are usually extreme minimums and maximums set obviously).
 
dmorris68

dmorris68

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I think a lot of it is based on personal preference. Technically, a Multi-Table SNG is a MTT, but it is obviously also a SNG. What you left out was the STT(Single Table Tourney), and that is what the traditional SNG that you are talking about is. They are both SNGs, just one is MTT and one is STT, but the majority of the time when someone is talking about an SNG, it is of the STT kind. Hope that helped clarify some things
True, I typically use SnG instead of STT since it's rare if ever to have the latter that isn't also the former. And I think this convention is what leads to my uncertainty, because most writers and forum posters seem to refer to "SnG vs MTT" when they probably really mean "STT vs MTT," but it's not always obvious and I wasn't sure if that was a correct assumption.

SNG's are single or multi-table tournaments that start when a specific number of players have registered.

MTT's are multi-table tournaments that start at a specified time regardless of the number of entrants. (There are usually extreme minimums and maximums set obviously).
:p Well, I know the strict definition of a SnG vs a scheduled MTT, I was just looking for that clarification on that gray area around measurement of success. You often see a fairly polarized reference to "SnG" compared to "MTT" with no real acknowledgment of the gray area between them. Multi-table SnG's are technically MTT's, as absoluthamm pointed out, but when looking at your numbers, how do you normalize the data between the two, or do you even bother? I was wondering if there was an established convention that I just wasn't aware of.

I'm pretty sure that my assumption of treating 45+ player SnG's as MTT's for purposes of stats is close to being accurate, I just can't help but think the smaller fields will skew some of the numbers -- but perhaps it's not statistically significant and I shouldn't be concerned about it. I'm just a bit OCD about knowing and speaking in proper terms.

To give a specific example: a 22% ITM would be considered very good by full MTT stats, but only mediocre by STT stats. What about the same ITM% for someone who played 45-180 player SnG's? I'm thinking it's slightly less successful than the same ITM% for a full MTT player, but how much so?
 
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absoluthamm

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I agree, everyone assumes that a SNG is a STT, but it isn't always, but the STT SnGs are much more common I believe than the MTT SnGs
 
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