Originally Posted by BrentD22
I bust out of tournamnets so often vs. the BB on crazy stupid hands.
...If you think your tournament stats are bad, you should check out mine.
I'am UTG and I raise to 3XBB/90 early in the tournament with pp7's. Not a great hand, but I was hoping to only see a flop and maybe hit a set who knows. Everyone folds to the BB only have to call 60 huh why not play my Qd3d maybe I'll get lucky?
...Well, the BB is getting about 2:1 on his money to call. The stacks are deep and if hits a strong flop, he might be able to get you to give up a lot of your chips. Honestly, here I might make this call with a similar just because of a) large stack relative to the blinds a b) odds Im getting.
The flop AdKd7d - now I was happy cause of the 3 d's on the board. He bet 90 (looked like a draw to me) so I pushed all in so he didn't have a chance to catch another d on the turn or river.
...I think you meant to say you weren't happy about the 3 diamonds. Or maybe you were. Question: If you think his bet was weak bet, wouldn't the better option been have to raise him and see where he stands? Lets look at a few possible scenarios:
Before we do that, lets assume that starting stacks are 1500 and blinds are 15/30. So, after you opponent bets out on the flop the pot is: 285. Your stack is: 1410 and your opponents is: 1320. The scenarios:
A-You shove all in. You risk 1410 of your stack to win 285. Your opponent calls and has the flush and you dont improve. You have outs on the redraw, but you're going up against a made hand.
B-You shove all in, again risking your stack for a small flop. Your opponent calls with the flush draw and hits it on the turn or the river. Now here, you had a strong hand and you got your money in with the best hand at the time, but the question is was it worth to risk your tournament life on such a small pot?
C-Your opponent bets 90 and you repop him to 290. Your opponent calls the bet and a diamond hits the turn. Your opponent checks, you check trying to pair the board on the river. It misses and your opponent makes a small value bet and you fold the 4 flush board. You give up the hand, but you're still in the game.
D-Your opponent bets out, you reraise an your opponent calls. The turn is a blank. You opponent checks, you bet, he calls. The river is a blank, the opponent bets out small, you call, and fold to a flopped flush. Again, you lost the hand, but you're still in the game.
The above examples were all losing scenarios, but the point is that you could've gone about the hand in a different way, still lost, but still be in the game.
He thinks and thinks and thinks and then finally calls with Qd3d = slowroll.
...I agree he is slowrolling, but Id be busy fist pumping, too.
He had the best hand with out a doubt and he had to think about it? OK 2 things why was this ****ing DONK even calling with Qd3d in the BB?
...If he is a new player: probably over-valuing suited cards. Thinking, strategic player: He's probably putting you on a strong hand-pair, AK, AQ maybe. Hes getting 2:1 on his money and if he flops 2 pair or a flush and you hit your top pair or have an over pair he has a chance to bust you.
You can't know your not him so I ask him. He said I thought you where trying to steal my BB. I said I was UTG meathead. Then I asked why did you take so long to call? He said and I quote "I was scared you have a set". The chat erupted into DONK this and DONK that.... I finally was able to see his reply - he said "this is my first tournament on PokerStars".
...Again look up stats. I dont think he is a new player. This sounds like a little ploy to look like a bad player/dead money to other players. I dont see how a 'new' player can know and understand something like blind stealing and blind defending, but not know hand ranks. Also, name calling is not necessary.
The ****ing $55 $50,000 dollar/G is his first tournament on Pokerstars how nice a true life DONK that doesn't even know that the nut flush beats a set beat me cause he just thought I was trying to steal his blind!!!!!
...Read above reply, but for the sake of argument lets say he is a new player and he doesnt know hand rankings, why would the buy-in matter? Even if he is new (I dont want to say DONK because there is a difference between bad players and new players) I dont see why him playing in a $55 MTT would mean anything. Maybe he has a lot of money and wants to learn playing the big games. Who knows and who cares. Completely irrelevant, unless you think that all new plays have to start at the lower stakes...
I wish to thank all the people that say DONKs get lucky in the short term and it will adventually run out.
...Show me a bad player who is winning and I'll show you a bad player who is still running hot. Thats all it is.
Why do they have to get lucky vs. me so ****ing often? I never bust out of a tournament vs. a hand that A should have been played and B with out a bad beat.
...Selective memory. What is 'often' Also, whats with the talk about hands that should/shouldn't be played? Where are the rules and regulations that tell me and every other player what to and not to play?
Some might say would you have been happier if he had say QdJd and he hit is flush (royal flush draw) sure I would have been happier and felt better unless the guy wasn't ****ing sure if a flush beat a set!
...Even if he did he did have QdJd, he still hit his hand and got you to pay him off. So, why would that make you feel better? Because the hand he called with PF was one of the hands he 'should' be playing? Also, did you consider the possibility that you opponent was setting a trap? Yeah, you had a set but there were 3 suits on the board. Try testing out the waters next time with a raise. See where you're at in the hand instead of risking your $55 tournament so early for such a small pot.
Originally Posted by philthy
Also, you seem to throw the word 'donk' around a lot. Ever consider the possibility that this play is actually new and doesn't know what he is doing? I have to say, your play wasn't exactly pro-like. In fact, I'd say is pretty borderline donkish the way you played the hand. I dont think of the word DONK as just "A bad player" but also "A player who makes bad moves/decisions" and that, IMO, is what you did.
Of course, I wont say anything because I and everyone else knows I fall into the donk category. ...but hey, sometimes it takes one to know one.
ETA: Just read that starting stack is 3K, which makes your shove play an even worse one. Maybe you should be more concerned on how to improve your game more and not risk your tournament so early. If I were you, I'd be more upset at how I played the hand than my opponents holdings.
Just a thought.
Very well said Philthy. With such insightful knowledge how can you say you are a donk.