Originally Posted by ramdeebam
Now this has been debated before and Iíve had a thread with something simular before.
Itís the theory of ďif you canít beat micros you will never beat anything higherĒ
Now, Iím not really a lossing player, more break even at the minute with 0.1/0.2 level. I can sit there for hours, playing but long term success at these levels seems next to impossible to me.
Now i know what people are going to say:
ďplay preminum hands only and play aggresiveĒ Ė Thatís fine because i do.
Problem is, it works on occasions but everyone literally does call a raise with crap. So say after 2/3hours of grinding for example like the other night i was up about $4.00 playing ABC poker. So...youíd begin to think yeah they are beatable however Iíve literrally had callers all over the show pushing down all sorts of crap and luckily mine have held up.
Anyyyway, so you again get a good hand and play TAG only for now to be sucked out when your massive favorite. This only has to happen a couple of times for your profit to now be in the red. So what am i supposed to do? Fold my premnums when showing a profit or something lol? Itís a joke.
Perfect example last night. I had AA and raised 4xBB and yep you guessed it 5 callers at 6maxtable.
Now, would i of got even one caller caller if the money was actually worth something? Proberly not.
Anywaym on the flop comes rainbow and possible straight draw and i knew someone would be holding a straight draw. I tried one last raise to then be re-raised and re-reaised again by others so i folded. 2 left in and at show down one called my raise with something like 8,5 os and one called with A,4. The 8,5 won with a straight.
I asked the guys ďwhy would you call a raise, clearly i had high pair or at least a pairĒ Their answer? ďitís only 6 centsĒ True and indeed itís nothing to fret about but this is the take everyone has on the game at this level. ďits only a few cents iím gonna callĒ
The point is, this happens 9 times out of 10. A raise at these levels means absolutely NOTHING so how the **** are you supposed to play? The point is, someone 9 times out of 10 will call your raise. Did i get this at a casino playing cash games for the first time ever at 5/10 stakes? No i didnít and i walked of with over £500 in profit..
So how does peoples theories of if you canít beat the lowest levels you canít beat the higher ones. Absolute rubbish to be honest, people just donít know how to fold or not bothered about lossing a few bucks. At the higher level this would never of got called unless they was holding something decent.
Over time you might just about show a profit but the basic concept of poker doesn't exsist at this level, what am i supposed to do? It happens time and time again it seems pointless. What are your suggestions? Deposit a lot of monies and try luck at higher levels? It's driving me mad trying to build a roll sat there for hours to show a profit and to carry on playing ABC poker etc to then lose 2 of your BIG hands to absolute garbage..i'm really just stuck on what to do.
I AGREE 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ALSO THE RAKE WILL DESTROY EVERYONE.
There are a lot of probably good players on this forum who are making money at higher levels but at the 2NL/ 5NL/ 10NL level you are not playing Poker.
Let me give you an example.
You paly TAG, VPIP 11/12 with a 10 PFR. You fold like a mother, You are dealt KK UTG. You raise 4xbb (or 6bb). What happens 90% of the time? Everyone folds and you collect the blinds. Then 5% of the time you get a caller and you flop an overpair. You make a small c-bet to price out any draws. What happens? They fold. Now, 2.5% of the time what happens?
You raise get one opr more callers. You flop an overpair on a ragged board. You bet out and get re-raised. Not knowing what you are up against you re-re-raise. Your opp shoves. You now have close to 1/2 of your stack in the pot and have no idea what you are up against. Figguring that now you may be beat but have invested most in the pot you so call. The villain has flopped two pair or a set orand your money is gone after an hour of folding, waiting for a good hand. The final 2.5% of the time you raise pre-flop, get re-raised by a donkey with VP of 45. You 4bet shove and he calls showing A3o. The 1st card on the flop is of course the A and you are done.
These are NOT hypothetical examples; I can show HUNDREDS of examples of this. Then you figure in the rake which is so exorbitant that it makes perfect sense why Full Tilt gave me tons of free money. ($ 145 in bonuses) because they got every penny plus iin rake. I have gotten to the point where I can tell when Full Tilt decides they need to up their take because you will see lots of AA vs AA and AK vs AK hands.
All the books by Harrington, Miller, Sklansky, etc. will do you ABSOLUTELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY ZERO GOOD. They will teach you how to play higher stakes but are useless for the micros and in fact are useless at the $ 1/ $ 2 Casino games where idiots love to call $ 15 preflop raises with J2 "because they feel lucky" and you know what? They are and you're not.
The only way I have figured out to play micros is this. From EVERY Position at the table EXCEPT the button you limp with any pocket pair or suited connector from AKs to 76s or 2 gappers from AQs to 75s. FOLD ALL UNSUITED BROADWAY CARDS INLCUDING AK & AQ. If you make TPTK or two pair you are likely behind if you get resistance and if you are strong you'll get no action. If you are raised a standard amt call unless you hold AA/KK and then 3bet. If the pot is multiway fold everything but AA/KK and then close your eyes and shove. After the flop, you will miss 65-70% of the time so you check/ fold. When you do hit hard you check/ call or check/ raise depending on board texture and opponent. Lead out on the turn regardless of what card hits. If you are raised and the turn did not improve your draw then fold unless you have at least one pair. If you get to the river with one pair then it is check/ fold. If you made the nuts or close to it make a pot sized bet. Don't worry they're going to call.
Don't ever bluff, don't try to 'represent a hand' don't shove with strong draws and remember ANY pair is just one pair. No Limit Hold'em is a game of IMPLIED ODDS
. Your hole cards are only 40% of your final hand so don't lose your stack with them.