What pocket pairs are for set mining only?

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thomasguy3419

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Hi just wondering what pocket pairs are strictly for set mining only? I know that 22-88 I only set mine with and JJ+ are good without a set but what about 99-1010? Are these only good for set mining or what? I try to play 99-1010 like I would play JJ but it don't end well for me they show a higher pocket pair or over cards come up.

What pocket pairs are good for raising under the gun? I usually fold 22-77 under the gun but when I raise 88-1010 under the gun it puts me in difficult situations post-flop. Please help.
 
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Rational Madman

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55 and below are 100% only worth if you hit some weird straight draw or the classic 3kind 4kind scenario.

In fact such low sets are worth so much more than high sets when it comes to fullhouse situations for your opponent where you hold the 4kind hand. You can't get nearly as much out of such a situation if you are both deep stacked and you reraise shove them so readily, they will consider you either have better FH or 4kind etc but when the other set is so low as 22JJ (they have the jack) they never ever perceive you as having 2222 and it is actually much better to have sets with low cards in almost ALL such situations (222) etc when the other is somehow hitting good. You get far more from low set-hits where the majority of the hit is in your hand than high set-hits in terms of post-flop aggression (preflop-thinking: of course high sets benefit you more)
 
Stuey

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You should learn to play all pocket pairs from 22 up to AA. Don't fork your pairs in Set-mining and others. If you always raise with AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT and AK and limp with other pairs from 99 down to 22 for set mining, you got a big problem because when the flop comes 6, 4, 2 and you raised preflop smart players will know you cannot have flopped a set or a straight. If the flop comes down like K, 6, 3 and you raised preflop the same smart players will know you cannot have a set of sizes or set of treys. If you limped and got to the flop with 3-4 players and even if you flop a small set on the K, 6, 3 flop, you not gonna get action because an AK or a KQ probably are not out there in a limped pot. So, yes, you win but win small.
 
Stuey

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For me its 22-77
So, with 22-77 you try to limp and see a flop and if you don't flop a Set you fold if over-cards are present on the flop and a villain bets?

Well, that mentality will never put money in your stack and I assure you that winning Hold'em is not design to be played that way. If you limp with 22-77 and then, when the flop disappoints you (which it usually does), you basically give up. How you expect to win in this game? - Flopping a Set is not required in order to make money at Hold'em and if you limp with 22-77 but raise with the big premium pairs you are out of luck if villain raises every time you limp and get out of your way when you raise. So, you win small with premium pairs and cannot see flops to set-mine in raised pots due to the fact that a raised pot cuts down your odds to set-mine profitable.

You guys are playing reverse poker because I see here most people play small and medium pocket pairs and small-medium suited connectors as a speculative hands to limp in pots and give up if they miss. If you guys base your entire strategy on flopping big hands with pocket pairs or suited connectors and winning at the showdown, .., well, you are not going to win. Period.

There is, however, no such thing as “flop-hitting skill.” Of course, some hands naturally hit more flops than others. But no player is any better at hitting flops than another. When you’re playing in a regular NL Hold'em game, guess what your opponents are trying to do? - They’re trying to hit the flop hard. You can’t play the same way your opponents play and expect to win, because you will not.
 
Ahoy

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Good points mentioned above... Limping small pairs is not really profitable... I sometimes do this to mix up my opening range (I tend to limp a lot lately with certain hands) but otherwise its more senseful to raise it as any other pocket pair...

Set mining is really not profitable at all... You dont have to play your cards, you should better play your opponents cards.. he has no clue what your holding is. This set mining strategy is basically just effective if you want to reach showdown every time. thats basically only situation if you hit with a medium-to-low pocket pair (lets say 22-TT) and your opponent calls you down pairing his A to J.
This will happen so rarely that you will never be profitable doing this.
 
Stuey

Stuey

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Good points mentioned above... Limping small pairs is not really profitable... I sometimes do this to mix up my opening range (I tend to limp a lot lately with certain hands) but otherwise its more senseful to raise it as any other pocket pair...

Set mining is really not profitable at all... You dont have to play your cards, you should better play your opponents cards.. he has no clue what your holding is. This set mining strategy is basically just effective if you want to reach showdown every time. thats basically only situation if you hit with a medium-to-low pocket pair (lets say 22-TT) and your opponent calls you down pairing his A to J.
This will happen so rarely that you will never be profitable doing this.
You are absolutely right and very correct. It seems to me you know your game. You are a real player. I respect that.

Many players, the majority of players, get in trouble with small-medium suited connectors and small-medium pocket pairs because they play them only for their ability to make big hands. With a hand like 7♦6♦ or 44 they think: “I’ll get in cheap to see a flop and if I don’t clobber my hand I’ll fold and get out.” Once again, this mindset doesn’t get the money because we all miss 66% of all flops and on top of all this the medium suited connectors and small-medium pairs pairs are not profitable to continue after the flop when villain will offset the price of seeing another card in such a way that we cannot call and continue.

The money are hidden in a place that most people can never imagine, until people can learn how to find where the money are they will continue to lose and keep the game good for us.
 
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Serjo600

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small pairs working very good in the middle stage of tourney if u have strong stack or if u play only pair hand and checking ur sets
 
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ritehere

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Of course set mining can be done with any pocket pair. But for me I have had the best set mining with 22-77.
 
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forfiter47

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So, with 22-77 you try to limp and see a flop and if you don't flop a Set you fold if over-cards are present on the flop and a villain bets?

Well, that mentality will never put money in your stack and I assure you that winning Hold'em is not design to be played that way. If you limp with 22-77 and then, when the flop disappoints you (which it usually does), you basically give up. How you expect to win in this game? - Flopping a Set is not required in order to make money at Hold'em and if you limp with 22-77 but raise with the big premium pairs you are out of luck if villain raises every time you limp and get out of your way when you raise. So, you win small with premium pairs and cannot see flops to set-mine in raised pots due to the fact that a raised pot cuts down your odds to set-mine profitable.

You guys are playing reverse poker because I see here most people play small and medium pocket pairs and small-medium suited connectors as a speculative hands to limp in pots and give up if they miss. If you guys base your entire strategy on flopping big hands with pocket pairs or suited connectors and winning at the showdown, .., well, you are not going to win. Period.

There is, however, no such thing as “flop-hitting skill.” Of course, some hands naturally hit more flops than others. But no player is any better at hitting flops than another. When you’re playing in a regular NL Hold'em game, guess what your opponents are trying to do? - They’re trying to hit the flop hard. You can’t play the same way your opponents play and expect to win, because you will not.




nah, I never limp, I just try to see a cheap flop with this kind of hands, and then depends on the action, sometimes when flop is bad I can try to steal the pot, if I flop it's obviously perfect for me
 
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mrpolyglott

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I'm also interestecd in the way small and medium pocket pairs should be played,there was a bunch of times I missed the flop with pocket pairs and didn't know what to do either make a CBet or just check, can't make my mind:confused:
 
melodyman169

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Decision to play or not to play 99 or TT depends on your seat by table I think
 
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Smokewood

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You should learn to play all pocket pairs from 22 up to AA. Don't fork your pairs in Set-mining and others. If you always raise with AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT and AK and limp with other pairs from 99 down to 22 for set mining, you got a big problem because when the flop comes 6, 4, 2 and you raised preflop smart players will know you cannot have flopped a set or a straight. If the flop comes down like K, 6, 3 and you raised preflop the same smart players will know you cannot have a set of sizes or set of treys. If you limped and got to the flop with 3-4 players and even if you flop a small set on the K, 6, 3 flop, you not gonna get action because an AK or a KQ probably are not out there in a limped pot. So, yes, you win but win small.

NEVER limp
 
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paulsmall007

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yea i dont see why u would limit to only set mining certain sets. mix it up and not being predictable is a big part of the game.
 
dimon4ik89

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a small pair is good

a small pair is good, but it is not possible to take a lot of risks on it, I think a raise should be given no more than three-bet. Anyway, when the pair on hand is already an advantage before the flop
 
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