What do you do here? 1/2 Cash spot

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kdg730

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Villian 1 $400ish limps mid position
Villian 2 $400ish limps behind
Hero $600ish SB raises to $15 with KK
BB $300 and first limpers call

Flop Qd3cJd
Hero bets $35 (should have been bigger yes)
Bb calls $35
V1 raise to $100
V2 tanks and calls $100

Keeping in mind these people call with anything
Whats your move?
 
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psychoiticmaniac

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Well most of the people would suggest to raise or go all in as u have a higher pair. But I would suggest to just call it and check the turn. The Villians might have a flush draw of diamonds or a open ended straight draw. So I think raising wont b right. I am a tight player so I think for different possibilities.
 
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kdg730

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I thought about calling but i think its unprofitable out of position. Lets say any diamond/straight card hits the turn, someone is likely betting at least $150 into the pot and were gonna be folding most likely. On the other hand if a brick hits and someone has QJ or 33 im gonna be facing the same action. Even hitting a K wouldnt be comfortable...
 
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jsh169

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Easy fold qj3 is not a good flop for ak, especially multiway. I wouldn't of even cbet here, it hits calling ranges very hard and we have 2 opponents.
 
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aznman08

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But I would suggest to just call it and check the turn. The Villians might have a flush draw of diamonds or a open ended straight draw. So I think raising wont b right. I am a tight player so I think for different possibilities.

Well if your thinking for different possibilities, then I ask you why are we flatting raise then checking turn? Are we trying to get them to bet when the turn bricks?

Its one thing to consider flatting however you don't seem to have a plan for the rest of the hand which means we're playing blindfolded.

Mind you: playing tight and flatting to a raise are not the same thing.

I thought about calling but i think its unprofitable out of position. Lets say any diamond/straight card hits the turn, someone is likely betting at least $150 into the pot and were gonna be folding most likely. On the other hand if a brick hits and someone has QJ or 33 im gonna be facing the same action. Even hitting a K wouldnt be comfortable...


First thing to ask is do you have any reads on villians? Are they the type who's calling any 2 preflop? Are they passive pre and betting their draws on the flop? etc.

Also, do we have the Kd? Its something to consider especially since its likely we're playing for stacks at this point. There's also a possibility that the BB may shove at the flop as he has under $300 at the flop and acts behind you.
 
A2345Razz

A2345Razz

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I probably muck...depends a lot on V1/V2.

Guy just calls off more than 1/4 of his stack after "tanking" for a bit....seems fishy as hell in a live game. His range has yu crushed imho.
 
suby_rafael

suby_rafael

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I would have folded here since you say the players are loose and call pretty wide range. But something different happened here, they probably know you are a tag player but still villain 1 raises your cbet which suggests he has your hand beat or atleast thinks he does or he has a draw. But another thing which is even more surprising is the cold call from villain 2. So now Alarm bells should be ringing in our head as we could be beat in atleast one of the two spots if not both. Probably best to let this one go.:eek:
 
blueskies

blueskies

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What is villain 1 open limping with? Does V2 have KT?

It seems one of them has 33 or QJ.

Raised there in a 4 way pot, KK's probably no good.

Wat are the stats on villains?
 
IPlay

IPlay

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I would of opened to $20 pre since you are OOP and people don't like to fold pre in live $1/$2. You don't really want to take KK to the flop 3-4 way OOP. I would honestly just muck that flop, not worth getting stacked on and you are probably beat.
 
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stlbluesfan

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I'm tossing them, with a call, a raise and a call I'm figuring I'm behind at least one of them.
 
btc87

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You are deep, cant just bet/get it in 4 way with a pair. Check call to the end if the cards are safe and there is no big action.
 
IPlay

IPlay

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You are deep, cant just bet/get it in 4 way with a pair. Check call to the end if the cards are safe and there is no big action.

This is literally the worst possible thing you can do in this spot.
 
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luckyhearts

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Hard fold there...prolly got to do it tho. Your first bet was too small, 15 in a 1/2 is going to get a lot of implied odds calls, got to bet enough to get rid of the small pairs and the qj.

not that I would fold it, I allin!!!...my 1/2 stats are horrid.
 
btc87

btc87

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This is literally the worst possible thing you can do in this spot.

Ok, offer a better line - bet bet bet into 3 ppl with a pair? lol
Why even we should try to make the 4way pot big on the flop without a strong hand?
 
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FixdIncm

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do you have the Kd? based on your limited description, I think you should either call and lead, get it in on a blankish turn or raise get it in. I don't love either option, tbh but it doesn't sound like either player is folding any worse pair and perhaps any draw.........
 
loafes

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Ok, offer a better line - bet bet bet into 3 ppl with a pair? lol
Why even we should try to make the 4way pot big on the flop without a strong hand?

The best line is to muck right now.
Failing that we raise/gii to hope they have draws or something like AQ/KQ that fishy player doesn't want to fold. But mucking is definitely best. By flatting pop we hate every turn and let villains draw without being charged extra or open ourselves to being forced out of the hand since we never know if heavy action is villain over playing something or a monster.
 
weldphaser

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FOLD, this sucks and its too bad it got so multi, but this happens., when v1 ra the flop he seems face up wit a set, or maybe a fd , but save your chips sucks fold KK , but fold and smile about it
 
IPlay

IPlay

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The best line is to muck right now.
Failing that we raise/gii to hope they have draws or something like AQ/KQ that fishy player doesn't want to fold. But mucking is definitely best. By flatting pop we hate every turn and let villains draw without being charged extra or open ourselves to being forced out of the hand since we never know if heavy action is villain over playing something or a monster.

This, I am not getting it in with any pair in that spot.
 
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