Value Bet vs Protect Hand

O

OJACE

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Hi im reasonably new to the game but i was just wondering if anyone can tell when i should be value betting my hand and when i should be protecting (getting my opponent out the pot asap). For example i hit two pair on an open ended straight board and was reasonably confident i had my oppenent beat. but come the turn he had his straight and i knew that if i had put some larger bet on the flop this would of never of happened but alternativly i wouldnt of got the extra value out of the hand if he had not hit it. Thanks in advance:)
 
Aces2w1n

Aces2w1n

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I think you answered your own question. Bet bigger. And if your opponent gets his draw it's simple *shut down*
 
Jillychemung

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Your choice to value bet vs protect all depends on the board texture, your read on opponents hand range and read on opponents likely reaction to either bet size.

If CO raises 3x and you call from the BTN with 9s8s and blinds fold, then the flop comes 8h9cTh and the CO cbets 1/2 pot - you may need to call, raise 1/2 pot or overbet the pot, you reads on the opponent will make the difference.
 
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jcla6985

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How sure are you that your hand with withhold through a showdown (all cards shown and you both show). Poker is really too situation to answer this question
 
Thinker_145

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Remember one thing, if someone flops a flush draw with no pair on the board then they are NOT folding it before the turn. Even if you go all in you are going to be called by a lot of players and pretty much everyone if they have the nut flush draw.

If someone has an open ended nut straight draw with no pair on the board then again its very difficult to make them fold before the turn.
 
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swingro

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There is no bet to protect your hand. There is only valuebet. You have the best hand so you bet to extract value. Protecting your hand comes as a consequence of a valuebet . If he has a flushdraw for example and you have top pair. You bet and he has to pay if he wants to chase it. What will happen if he hits and what will you do? For this you need to learn poker. If he does not chase he will fold. But you had bet for value. You want him to pay in the first place with a worse hand not to fold. If you want them to fold a worse hand than you should be relearning the basics of poker .
There are only 2 type of bets. For value and as a bluff. The information, protecting your hand and all other things that you can think come as a consequence of a valuebet or of a bluff.
 
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rumsey182

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There is no bet to protect your hand. There is only valuebet. You have the best hand so you bet to extract value. Protecting your hand comes as a consequence of a valuebet . If he has a flushdraw for example and you have top pair. You bet and he has to pay if he wants to chase it. What will happen if he hits and what will you do? For this you need to learn poker. If he does not chase he will fold. But you had bet for value. You want him to pay in the first place with a worse hand not to fold. If you want them to fold a worse hand than you should be relearning the basics of poker .
There are only 2 type of bets. For value and as a bluff. The information, protecting your hand and all other things that you can think come as a consequence of a valuebet or of a bluff.

mostly right i would counter that there is no value bet in a sense, just playing a profitable range and frequency vs villains exploitative habits and all things result from that but you basically nailed it except for one thing

there is no bluff, or value bet

there is ev of betting, checking, ect

and ideally it all nets to be +ev

and this plays into our overall game plan which we will adjust as we gather more information
 
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mac11

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Value betting and protecting are the pretty much the same thing. You have the best hand now but may not later on, so you bet. keep bet sizing similiar without good reason not to. When youre bluffing you can bet a bit on the smaller side or whatever you think will make them fold. If youre playing against a really bad player and can get away with bigger for value because he always calls then do. Semi bluffng a little smaller than for value if you think they wont notice.
 
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Guru44

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Your betting sizes should be balanced. If you bet x amount as a value bet, you should be betting x amount for protection, as well as x amount as bluffs. The hardest person to play against is someone who merges all three of these bets. It is your job to calculate what bet/raise you need to make to outprice your opponents range. Whatever that size is, it should be similar in all situations. The only time value betting should vary (other than rare/specific scenarios) is on rivers.
 
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Guru44

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When you bet, you are either trying to extract value, or trying to make your opponent fold (bluff). Try to change your mind state from fearing what's to come (protecting your hand), to mathematically outpricing your opponent's range for value (value bet).
 
bushy_lufc

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At lower limits when flopping big hands i would generally lean towards betting big especially on boards such as the one you are referring to. I don't see many micro stakes players laying down a half decent draw on the flop so make sure you get your value there and while you are doing that you are also protecting your hand as you're making them pay a poor price to outdraw you.
 
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gunburger

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There is no bet to protect your hand. There is only valuebet. You have the best hand so you bet to extract value. Protecting your hand comes as a consequence of a valuebet . If he has a flushdraw for example and you have top pair. You bet and he has to pay if he wants to chase it. What will happen if he hits and what will you do? For this you need to learn poker. If he does not chase he will fold. But you had bet for value. You want him to pay in the first place with a worse hand not to fold. If you want them to fold a worse hand than you should be relearning the basics of poker .
There are only 2 type of bets. For value and as a bluff. The information, protecting your hand and all other things that you can think come as a consequence of a valuebet or of a bluff.

This is 100% correct.

The closer equities run, the more you want to stick in the pot with your made hands. A simpler way to put it would be, the more wet the flop, the more money you'll want to put in for value. For instance, if you have 89hh on a 8c9c7d flop, then 2 AcJc is almost flipping with you but you are slightly ahead and can never fold so you'll need to make your bets bigger for value. But you also need to be able to shut down. For instance, if the turn brings the Tc in this spot I would almost certainly believe I am beat at this point. So make your bets big while the board is wet and your hand is made. Be able to shut down when draws get there.

Conversely, the dryer the board (and higher the board) you'll want to bet smaller for value. You'll want him to call a half pot bet when he only has 20% equity. But it is catastrophic to move him off a hand that you are crushing because you bet too big such as AcTh5d when we have AT and villain has A8. Betting too big here and getting him to fold can be worse than betting too small and allowing draws to come in imo.

But to re-iterate, there is no protection. This is never a reason to bet. There is only value. So if you think he has a draw, you want to extract the most value possible when you think he will pay to see a turn and river.

Don't pay attention to these posts that talk about "all depends on your reads". Or, "depends on how villain is playing". This may have some small influence on your decision but in the long run, it wont matter.
 
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IPlay

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Just bet to where you are not giving them the correct pot odds and if they call it is a mistake and there part and that is the best you can do. In the long run it is positive EV for you and you will profit, but of course they will call against the pot odds and suck out sometimes. Its poker.
 
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